No, calm down, calm down. Yuka is actually trying to help, isn't she? She's rude and difficult and you're confused but she is, in the end, trying to help you. "O-okay Y-yuka." You say, biting your lips from the inside, closing your eyes and taking a deep breath. This has all been so confusing, but you can't lose it now, right? "Okay?" Yuka's tone mocks you. "That's it? Okay? Ha." She laughs without humour. You open your eyes and look at her again. She's sneering. Sneering at you? "Where's your pa-" She starts, but you feel yourself starting to boil over.
"Shut up!" You shout, surprising yourself. Yuka's eyes widen.
Calm? Who cares about calm? You've been through hell and back and you still don't understand what's going on. You've been stalked, attacked, dragged into another world, assaulted, had your mind desecrated, passed out and lost so much blood you just want to lie down and pass out. Fuck Yuka and fuck her condescending tone.
"Hm?" Yuka just stares at you. "I said shut up!" You shout again, feeling tears of rage springing to your eyes unbidden. God, how are you even holding this together? The sheer pressure, everything moving too fast, everything should shut up, everything should go away and leave you alone. Yuka wants what from you, a plan? Gulping, you clench your hands into fists. "Just stop-" "That's it!" Yuka says off of a sudden, her face lighting up. "Come on! You can only hold it in for so long!" And this, Yuka's insane demands. What is she after? What could she possibly want? Why does she have to be like this? You should have left her chained up in that shed. You don't need this pressure, this confusion.
You feel yourself cracking, you can't take all this any more.
"Shut up!" You repeat again, at a complete loss for words. "Shut up shut up shut up!" "Yes!" Yuka all-but screams back at you, actually trying, but failing, to get up from the ground. Stop! You want to carve the word into her chest in your anger Stop! Leave me alone! Let me fucking hide, sleep, run away! But no words come out of your mouth, you just stand there, shaking with rage and confusion. You know this isn't right, Yuka isn't the object of this anger, but there's nowhere else to direct it. Who should you shout at? Renko? This doesn't make any sense, you just want out. "Lose it! Get angry!" Yuka says. "Come on, everyone has their limits!" "Argh!" You grit your teeth with the frustration and turn on your heel, leaving Yuka lying there. You can't deal with this, or anything right now. Yuka was right, you need to plan, or someone needs to plan, but you can't think straight right now, you can't make sense of anything. The inside of your head is full of anger and confusion, with nowhere to turn, you need to ...
[ ] So sit alone somewhere, outside, far away from Yuka. [ ] Find Renko, scream, shout and cry. [ ] Sleep. Forget about all of this. [ ] Turn back around and kick Yuka in the side, take your frustration out.
[x] Find Renko, scream, shout and cry. But not "scream, shout and cry" at her, as if it were her fault. Hopefully.
>>[ ] So sit alone somewhere, outside, far away from Yuka. Viable solution, Shinji.
>>[ ] Sleep. Forget about all of this. We ARE very good at passing out, but usually it's because we're trying to break the laws of reality. And we'd never get anywhere safe without having encountered somebody or far away enough that we wouldn't take up to Yuka all over again.
>>[ ] Turn back around and kick Yuka in the side, take your frustration out. While I doubt that would hurt her in any way, we don't need her provoked any further right now. Ebolanon hasn't yet been taught the grace of "lashing out" though and since there's no contamination hinted ...
>>68717 More like Anonymous is utilizing "what sounds good at the moment" decision skills. The fact that: >>Calm down, maybe Yuka can give you some advice. She seems more helpful and lucid than before. metamorphized into: >>Lose your temper. How are you supposed to 'plan? Fuck this! doesn't help much.
Points if we keep yelling the same thing repeatedly, with each kick. D:
I know only one thing: I don't want to hit Yuka. Nothing good will come from it and she has no prompting to hit Yuka. Prompting and stress both lead to what happened earlier, but here there is no prompting. Ebolanon actually getting really angry and yelling, rather than being timid and shying, seems like a good start.
We've had character-building dealing with Renko being our confident; we've had prior characterization dealing with passing-out/sleeping after anxiety; we've had prior characterization about trying to run from our problems. Compared to all that, kicking Yuka just now seems to come out of nowhere, after what Satori said.
It seems like what Ebolanon would do if she had been broken, though.
>>68811 Honestly, I think that’s more anon’s doing than HY’s. Anon has the memory of a goldfish, so actions towards a character are usually based on how that character treats him in the latest update, rather than any sort of emotional attachment. When a character acts inconsistently, like Yuka is so prone to doing, anon flips out right along with them.
Are we just going to kick her or do we get to dish out some remark or another?
[x] Turn back around and kick Yuka in the side, take your frustration out. [x] "You're incorrigible. You never learn, never know better, you just can't change. That's why Yukari never took interest in you. And now you're just going on and wasting MY time."
Okay then. head back to the house. Ask Ran for a map of Gensokyo. Then ask various questions (like: who lives here?; Is she thrustworthy?) Then decide where do you want to go! I think, we have two options: SDM (Patchy) or Eintei (Eirin). We must know, what's happening here! Then when we know what's the problem of Gensokyo, maybe we can try to solve it. ALSO: GAP HERE MARY!
Behind you, Yuka starts laughing. A loud, rolling noise, echoing around the inside of your head. She's laughing at you! She's making fun of you! You can feel your fingernails drawing blood from the palms of your hands. "Running away?" Yuka asks between bursts of laughter. "Useless!" "Argh!" You turn back around, gritting your teeth, fists clenched in front of you, shaking with anger and frustration. "Shut up!" You scream at her. Yuka keep laughing, eyes closed, just lying there.
You're useless, you're a burden and an embarrassment but Yuka doesn't have to remind you of it! She doesn't have to say it! What ... where, how should she know anyway!" Fuck her, she doesn't know anything! You can feel yourself losing all control, even as a tiny part of your mind questions your actions, tries to tell you to calm down. You ignore its useless, misguided pleading.
You wind your foot back and plant it, hard as you can, on the side of Yuka's ribcage. The impact is a little anti-climatic, just a little thump and some pain in your toes, but Yuka winces, laugher ceasing in an instant. "Ow." She says, rubbing her side, grinning up at you Her expression blunts your anger, insides turning cold. Your hands shake uncontrollably with the adrenaline. You hit Yuka! Oh god, you hit Yuka! She's going to fucking kill you! Ohgodohgodohgod- "I-I-I'm s-s-sorry!" You start to back up, blood running cold in your veins as Yuka struggles to her feet, shaking and stumbling, spilling on the grass and finally righting herself. "Don't!" She shouts, frowning at your words. "Wha-" You feel like making a run for it, you could make it to the house from here, right? Oh, why did you let her out? Why? What on earth possessed you to kick her just then? You kept all that anger and frustration bottled up for so long and it all came spilling out, Yuka just happened to be the closest thing at the moment. "Don't apologise! Don't fucking grovel!" Yuka take a wobbling step forwards, trying not to fall back down again. She's healed a lot, but not completely. The side of her head is still a mess, wound just a little smaller now. You can't move, or reply, you feel like you're a tiny rodent, frozen before the gaze of a serpent. Yuka takes another step forward, eyes boring into yours. "Sorry this, sorry that, fuck your meekness!" Yuka rages, gritting her teeth. "Hit me again!" "What?" She finally stumbles forwards, hand rushing down. You squeal in surprise and squeeze your eyes shut, but Yuka just grips your shoulder, holding herself in place, bracing her feet so she doesn't fall down. "You heard me!" She says. "Where's all that anger?! Hit me again!" She says. "Wha-" "Useless!" Yuka spits onto the floor. "Stupid, ugly and useless." "Sh-shut up!" You say, but your words have no force behind them. "Ha!" Yuka laughs in your face. "Come on Yukari! Fucking hit me!"
[ ] Hit Yuka. [ ] Refuse, she's just trying to goad you. [ ] She's not got a tight grip on you, run away.
It certainly seems to be making Yuka happy. She said Yukari never gave her attention before. Now, Yukari, in the flesh(at least to her), is not only giving her attention, but she's reacting to her, getting angry at her, giving in to her demands, and beating the crap out of her. This must be the most enjoyable moment in Yuka's life.
The original Yukari probably would've refused to hit Yuka at this point just to let her stew in her own rage juice, or not get angry, period.
"N-no-" "Hit me!" "Yuka st-" "Hit me!" "Ah!" "Fucking hit me!" You screw up your eyes and pull your hand back, making a fist. You just want Yuka to shut up, stop talking! Let go of you! You've never thrown a punch in your life but she just keeps shouting at you! You lash out with your fist, hitting something hard, hearing a grunt, but you swear you hear a hiss of pleasure from Yuka underneath the pain. You don't follow through, just opening your eyes and clutching at your knuckles. They sting from the impact, red and sore. Yuka lets go of your shoulder, rubbing at her jaw. "There." She says, sighing, voice suddenly much calmer. "Isn't that better?" She peers at you. "Huh?" You just stand there, stunned, rubbing the back of your hand. "Violence has to be expressed." Yuka says, nodding once, as if this is the most solemn moment in the world. "You knew that before." Yuka reaches for your shoulder again, making you flinch, but she just steadies herself, taking a shuffling step closer and shifting some of her weight so she won't fall down.
Actually ... Yuka is right. On some level you do feel better, if only a little bit. You hit her! You feel guilty and confused by the vindication and satisfaction of having done that. You hit Yuka, you actually threw a punch! You ... you ... you don't ever want to do that again. Frowning at yourself, you look down. "Guilt is useless." Yuka says, using the same tone as a moment ago. Then she smiles a little, making you shudder. "We're going to take this slow." "T-take what s-slow?" Your eyes go wide at her words, this doesn't sound good. Yuka leans close, so her face is a few inches away from yours.
"Showing you how to do things." She says.
"W-what?" "Never mind now." Yuka says. "You need a plan, ideas, information." Yuka pauses. "You know what the greatest power in the world is?" She grins. You shake your head, gulping. "Will." She says. "I know you have it under there, Yukari." She pokes your forehead and you flinch at her touch. "Will is everything. You need will and the plan will fall into place." She says. "After all, do you think I plan?" Yuka snorts with laugher. "Forget Ran. She sits in Mayohiga trying to keep balance, to ... patch things up. This is beyond help. The heart has to be ripped out, heads cut off and the whole thing burned to the ground before it'll be rebuilt. Force, driven by will, it can be done." You can tell Yuka is rambling now, eyes wavering and unfocused. She must still be more injured than she looks, but you can't tear yourself away, her words hold you for some reason. She seems almost ... happy, different to her state of pleasure and elation you've seen before, savage joy when fighting. This just seems simple, honest happiness. "Now, you should look for people." She says. "Reimu needs to be found, I've looked but she's probably dead." Yuka shakes her head. "Find the body and fling it into the village, they'll pull each other apart fast enough, humans are factional like that. Someone needs to catch that fucking Mokou bitch and drag her to the Moon people, find out what's going on in there. Ran didn't tell you the half of it, you know that? Half of Gensokyo is missing or dead and there are things that shouldn't be here, walking the fucking woods in broad daylight, she won't accept it, she's just barred up in her own-" "Y-yuka-" "Hm?" "You ... you n-need to rest." You say, trying to get her to stop, anything to make her stop talking. You don't need this now, it all needs to slow down, even if Yuka isn't a direct threat to you anymore. "Rest." Yuka says, blinking very slowly. "You're right, as usual." She seems to slump a little. "Help me indoors, I've had my fill of sunlight."
[ ] No, leave her here. You freed her but she's on her own now. [ ] She's injured and she's trying to help you, even if she is doing it in a horrible way. Help her indoors.
[x] She's injured and she's trying to help you, even if she is doing it in a horrible way. Help her indoors. [x] Fill Renko in on what new information you've gathered. Try to make something of it together.
[x] She's injured and she's trying to help you, and she makes a lot of sense. Help her indoors.
Hmm, yeah, what is horrible? She did make a lot of sense. Ran didn't tell Ebolanon everything, as if she were trying to keep Ebolanon locked and isolated. Yuka has a more realistic view of the situation of Gensokyo right now, even if she also knows nothing. At least she's not lieing. This time.
Yuka is not right in the head and has an irrational way of doing things. Yuka wants to force things to work and wants to force Ebolanon to think a certain way. Look at what Yuka's way of thinking did; It got some foxes killed, innocent people hurt, Renko hurt, got herself her, and made the anon terrified of her.
Yuka has been nothing but a problem, besides that one time where she saved Ebolanon from that man. Even then she had the anon kill him when it wasn't necessary. I think you put too much trust in her, which is doing nothing but digging us a hole.
>>68927 I've been viewing this along the spectrum of: "You've created a existential anomaly and have consumed this reality and all those within the immediate area", "Gensokyo, along with the planet Earth, has been laid to waste", "Gensokyo is now a barren wasteland", "You have conquered the land of Gensokyo and subjugated its people", "You leave as is", "You restore the status quo", or "You usher in an unrivaled era of peace in the pocket dimension of Gensokyo."
I've got all my bases covered; anything outside of these and I am pleasantly surprised! Personally pulling for 'Warlord of Gensokyo' end, but if not here, Norseman's story still has potential.
Given Ebolanon's beginning of a Face Heel Turn and the fact that a certain somebody is trying to introduce the element of ruthlessness to her in order to get things done, I think such an ending looks possible now.
[X] She's injured and she's trying to help you, even if she is doing it in a horrible way. Help her indoors.
She may be nutty as a fruitcake, but much of what Yuka said makes sense. We need to look for people, Reimu especially, but we'll probably have to seek out what's left of the other power players in Gensokyo as well.
...well, the ones who aren't inclined to just up and kill us on sight, let alone after they learn whose shoes we're supposedly meant to fill, of course.
Considering what we saw of Mokou, I'm inclined to agree with Yuka's suggestion to catch her and hand her over to Eientei as a sign of goodwill. If only we had something similar we could do for Suika or Remilia. Things might be easier if we could get at least one of them on our side.
If we could actually mange to successfully subdue the fire-manipulating immortal, is there really much the werecow could do to us outside of a full moon? If nothing else, I'm pretty sure Yuka could take her.
We know everything, yet nothing about Gensokyo. First learn about its history, then learn about its present, then decide where do you want to go first. It would be a good idea to go to Eintei. Since it's less dangerous than the Mansion of the Scarlet's. Eirin should know about many things. However I'm unsure that this would be the right way. But maybe you could get immortality there...
ALSO: LEARN TO USE THAT WORM! LEARN TO GAP! TRAIN YOURSELF!
>>68970 >We know everything, yet nothing about Gensokyo. Now leaving Mary in the outside world comes round to bite us in the ass. Ran is not likely to tell us everything, Yuka should know what we need but her teaching methods are questionable.
>ALSO: LEARN TO USE THAT WORM! LEARN TO GAP! But we don't know if that overwrites our own personality. Being able to do something would certainly be a good thing, but if we put power to use, well, I don't see that in Ebolanon's personality (although we usually tend to go with the "Pierce the heavens"-option). At least not while we have that deal with Renko.
<HY> Basically anon has been actively voting against the story. They actually don't want the story that I'm trying to tell. They keep thinking in terms of 'power' or 'solving problems', they've never actually accepted playing a weak and mentally unwell character and they've all but ignored the problems and issues the other characters raise. I gave them a story with a dark and depressing tone,... <HY> ...they want something else out of it that they're not going to get. On top of that, because of trying to show all this to them with the writing, my style has degenerated and honestly ADP is linguistically ugly. <HY> I mean, Renko. <HY> For fuck's sake. <MissIzayoi> how aboutlol <MissIzayoi> I mean <HY> They either haven't realized or don't care that she is the most messed up character so far, all they see is 'lesbian h-scene ahoy!'
>accepted playing a weak and mentally unwell character I’ll admit, this has always bothered me. It’s such a huge departure that I really can’t put myself in the right mindset, and the more I read it the more irritating it gets. Like back in >>68647 we learned that showing even a bit of intelligence and foresight is way out of character for her, so what the hell are we supposed to do? Keep sitting around Mayohiga petting Satori and playing dress up with Renko while the world burns around us? I guess we’re supposed to just play morale support/psychologist for the entire story, and leave everything else to the people with a smidgen of competency.
I really do love the grimdark in this story, but it just feels so fucking odd mixed up with the moe stuff.
>>68980 IRC faggotry should stay in, might come as a surprise, IRC. If HY wants to tell us something, he usually does it himself, here.
>>68988 Actually, I miss those bad ends. I'm usually voting for the [x] Grovel or [x] Block everything out options, but usually that is to no avail and we're straying more and more from Ebolanon's meek personality. I don't see anything wrong with Renko though, we need someone to cling to and make sure we're not insane yet, although that could be practically everybody and is not limited to her. As long as it works out, everything's fine. If it backfires eventually, so be it.
>>68980 After reading that, I feel I may be the only reader taking the characterization cues HY is dropping somewhat seriously, or may be the only one reading at least half of them. Maybe no one remembers the earliest posts where HY talked about the story he was trying to write objectively. It's hard to say. It all prompts me to stop voting, however, because it's obviously what no one else voting wants.
I talked about "working on Gensokyo's problems" once, but only because it seemed impossible not to wax constructive thinking at some point, even if it were still fruitless thinking.
Perhaps HY needs to set-up a system of positive voting punishment.
And, for the love of god, people, stop talking about damned this-route and that-route. And trying to open a damn gap. HY has gone far out of his way to indicate we're killing ourselves before we even accomplish a fraction of a fraction of a useful gap. Satori passed out from just a glance!
since part of this was already posted, here's the rest to clarify:
<HY> I've just realized something. Plot in SDM worked because it was all linked to the female lead (Remi), after a route-lock. There was one story, they had to follow it. PoG worked because there was a purpose 'be a pirate' which came first to facilitate any interaction with characters. ADP's plot doesn't work because there is no purpose but 'stay alive.' <HY> ha, I guess my Renko really was right. You need purpose. <HY> Purpose, it's all about narrative purpose <HY> This is a valuable lesson.
<MissIzayoi> make a bad end! <MissIzayoi> Yuka goes inside. Renko tries to kill her. But Ebolanon stands between them... <HY> Bad Ends don't work Saguya, they just condition Anon into picking 'safe' options in working towards their goals. Their agenda is still the same. <HY> Some types of story simply won't work in this format. <HY> Because when conditioned right, Anon can do better. <HY> Look at RaAN <Kapow> we're heroic in RaAN <Kapow> it's hard to make decisions to be weak and irrational <Kapow> actually, those are kind of things that result from not making clear decisions <Kapow> the whole process of decision making runs counter to the mental processes of the character you want to write <HY> Yes Kapow! <HY> Exactly. <HY> This was doomed from the start. <Kapow> I think people are still enjoying it, though <Kapow> even if it isn't going the way you imagined <HY> Perhaps, but it still needs intensive care.
<UBOA> if you tell them yourself in plain english that you're pissed off with how they're acting and threaten to drop ADP I doubt they'd keep it up <Kapow> it's still not going to be easy to decide to act like someone who's weak and doesn't make clear decisions <HY> Plus the total lack of narrative purpose! <HY> I fucked up too. <Kapow> they'd be kind of lost, I think, and things would start to get weird and incoherent <Kapow> if anon can't vote to try to solve problems, they may just end up voting against solving them <Kapow> or picking the option that would have the most entertaining bad outcome
<HY> I think I've just realized the other reason SDM worked. Short updates.
>>68980 Even after reading this, i don't know what to change in the way i am voting. I don't know, do what >>68991 said? Play Psychologist for everyone strong who is messed up so that they can solve the problems?
And i don't even like Renko, i want to go out and explore Gensokyo and find out what happened or is happening. Get clues to what happened with Reimu and where everyone else is. Either go meet Remilia or go to Eientei.
>>68997 >i want to go out and explore Gensokyo and find out what happened or is happening
I think that's exactly what we're not supposed to do. We're just there to get someone to care for us and when we don't have anyone at our side, we are just miserable. I've found myself enjoying that idea ever since this started, although I know that's kind of sick. Or maybe I've got that wrong after reading all this.
ADP needs to go on hiatus. Proper hiatus, perhaps not to be resumed for a few months. As you can see from the stuff above, there are problems with the narrative and problems with my writing that are going to take a lot of effort to work out. I don't have the creative energy for that effort right now, I can't put in the time to write a story in which I am fighting the readers every step of the way. This is partly my fault, the pacing fell apart upon entering Gensokyo and I have started to hate sitting down to write, not having realised what was wrong with it. This needs intensive care that I cannot give it at the moment, due to my workload out in real life.
More importantly, this thing is linguistically ugly. I mean really, it's terrible. Look at it, my writing style has become messy and disgusting to read. Compare any of ADP to SDM, notice the clarity and simplicity of the latter. Somewhere down the line I forgot that less is more.
Anyway, I'm heading back to my home territory for now, I don't really know why I ever left it in the first place. I need to write something with 100% less angst and much less serious business to shake off my shitty style.
tl;dr: Enjoy your hiatus, I'm off to play with the Scarlets.
thinking about all the stuttering, i came upon this line way back in the first thread while i was rereading ADP where: "You don't have to be so blunt about it, I'm not that skittish." You say, feeling a little hurt.