Hello! I've been lurking about Touhou Project for who knows how long. I've read a few CYOAs here and there and well I start talking to my friends and I suggest a CYOA... And they want me to try doing one. So I'm going to try and do one! This is my first time really doing any project of this kind at all so I apologize if I make any very bad mistakes. I'm aiming for an update a day at least, although this depends on how busy I get. I'm currently in technical training for the USAF so my schooling takes priority so if I have a lot of homework or something that'll get done before I even think of updating the CYOA.
Weekends and every other Friday, well and this coming 4th of July, I'll be on a lot so I will attempt to do multiple updates in a day depending on if there's enough votes to justify an update.
So with that out of the way let me get started here! I hope you enjoy it.
PS: Never written 1st person either. So if it's quirky uhm... Hopefully that'll clear up eventually. Write-ins are pretty much going to be always allowed (within reason).
PSS: Picture not related to like. Anything. But I needed one.
Restorer in Gensokyo
Thump. I crack an eye open at the familiar sound and squint lazily at the clock resting on my nightstand. It ticks its way past seven and I yawn and rub my eyes sleepily. Time to get up I suppose... I yawn and roll out of bed, naked feet touching the somewhat cool wooden floor. As much as just crawling back under the covers and napping sounds today was going to be my first day at a new job. Apparantly youkai didn't have the skill, or probably just didn't feel like learning, to do something like build furniture and well I had the job of fixing all that. And youkai apparantly go through furniture like food. Probably all those wild danmaku battles or something. Or they just like breaking things, either way that was going to be my job now. Good pay at least.
A quick, rousing dip in the bath later and a nice bowl of some quickly made noodles and I pop the door open a bit to look down at the neatly rolled newspaper resting on the mat. That was the nice 'thump' in the morning. Of course these weren't usually thrown at the door like some paperboy might do, normally Aya would just plop them somewhere nearby and hope someone would read it. Still I had worked for her for a little bit and this somehow warranted her taking extra time to go ahead and throw the paper at my door to serve as an improvised alarm clock. Most people around here didn't particularly even like reading the tengu's newspaper but their loss I suppose, it had some pretty interesting articles from time to time. I pluck it from the ground and kick the door shut. I wonder what Aya had written about this time...
I wipe down the smooth, shiny surface of the antique table I had been spending the past several hours "fixing". It was less of fixing and more of building the thing from scratch - the 'table' had been dropped off early morning (or maybe late last night. No one was around when it was dropped off) and when I saw it sitting there I thought it was just a pile of scrap wood. Until I saw the work order, written by a one 'Sakuya Izayoi', and looking at it closer could pick out pieces of the original table in the pile. It hadn't been a very easy job considering most of the table needed to be completely rebuilt then correctly placed, and it was made of some pretty high-quality wood that the shop didn't exactly have in abundance. Still, as I look at it now it doesn't look too bad, though without a reference of how it looked originally I couldn't really be sure how good I had done at fixing the darn thing...
"Is that a new table you're cleaning Lanissa?" spoke up a voice behind me
I jump a little bit and ball up the rag in my hand then look over my shoulder at the young woman standing in the doorway. I recognized her as the owner of the workshop, so my boss, a one Miyuki. She was pretty nice although I hadn't really talked to her much beyond the whole initial hiring thing. I stand up and begin wiping off my hands in the rag.
"Naw this was an order I found when I came in this morning. I suppose a Sakuya Izayoi dropped it off sometime while everyone was gone, it was really in a bad shape when I found it though ze."
"Sakuya Izayoi you say? That would be that head maid of that Scarlet Devil Mansion. We make most of the furniture they have so... But well they get it all broken a lot too. What did it look like when you found it?"
I shrug and explain in detail the initial state of the table and the steps I took to go about fixing it. The entire time Miyuki just stood there listening while also examining the table, once in a while giving it a shake here and there and looking at it in detail. Once I finish speaking she plucked the written work order off the workbench and looked it over before looking back up at me with a smile.
"I have to say you did a good job. I actually remember seeing this table when they made it and you did pretty good on making new parts to it. Especially if you had just splintered fragments to really go off. I have to say I'm impressed, first day on the job and you did something that would normally require a few more hands and someone going to ask the furniture makers who build it and how. Did you also by chance look this order over in detail?"
"Er, well... No not really. I just kind of saw it and uh, started on it uhm... Why do you ask?"
"Then I guess you didn't see how much you're getting paid for doing this by yourself." said Miyuki thrusting the order forward, her index finger pointing to the numbers written on it, I cough in surprise at the numbers as Miyuki grins, "So I'll just give you your pay for a job well done, get the table sent off, and send you on your way. I'll give you the rest of the day off, can't have you getting all the work done! Go out and enjoy yourself, go spend some of that money maybe? I hear someone from Eientei is in selling some medicine if you need something like that... Or maybe you'll just go donate some of it to the poor Hakurei miko eh? Hahahahaha!"
Well that was interesting. I didn't expect to get paid so much just for fixing a table, sure it was a very broken table but that was a very generous amount to pay someone. It must've been pretty important or something. Or maybe they just have a lot of excess money. Guess it didn't really matter, it was maybe a bit past midday and I had the rest of the day to myself! So much time to myself, but what to do with it? Miyuki had mentioned someone from Eientei was in selling medicine, I wasn't feeling sick but I had heard of all the sorts of products that come out of Eientei. Could just go out and get something to eat or just go window shopping... What to do, what to do...
[ ] Visit the Eientei "shop" [ ] Go get something to eat for lunch [ ] Window shopping
>>89163 Not really. I'm being observant today, and I can see that this story has lots of potentials to explore. Besides, I need to do something to keep my motivational meter charged up for my current work.
>Oh dammit. Stupid Word ruined all the spacing in the first post. Here's the first section without the wall of text-ness. I'd suggest deleting your posts and starting over, so that none of them are messed up and they aren't out of order.
[x] Go get something to eat for lunch. And if we have the time: [x] Donate money to the poor Hakurei miko
As I stand there thinking over what to do for the day, my thoughts are interrupted by a rumble. In my stomach. I blush slightly and chuckle a bit.
"W-well... Guess I know what I should go do first..." I mutter to myself
I put my hands in my trouser pockets as I casually start the short walk to the commercial 'district' of the Human Village. It wasn't much of a district though so much as a particular area of the village that housed more stores then usual now that I thought about it. It was a pretty lively place at night though since it contained quite a few all night restaurants and some taverns - youkai had a particular like to hang around at night drinking sake. I hadn't really ever gone out to them though; the thought of being around so many youkai was slightly unsettling...
I turn the corner into an alleyway between two homes and once I emerge I find myself about roughly in the center of the village, the so called commercial 'district'. I take a quick scan of the area, noting which restaurants looked particular busy right now and wondering if anyone I knew was around. While I couldn't pick out anyone I could see I couldn't help but notice a short-haired young-looking girl carrying a great amount of food leaving the area, just the amount of food she had bought surprised me really - it looked like enough to feed a few families for a month! I wonder why she needed all that food... I shrug, too late now the girl had vanished down the main street towards the gate.
My stomach growls angrily at me again to draw my attention back to my original goal, filling up my stomach with some lunch. But what to eat first, decisions, decisions... I look over at a nearby ramen stand without too many people around and begin walking to it, some sushi later might sound nice but all the other restaurants looked a little busy. Might be better to just wait it out for a little bit. I fish around in my pocket for my wallet, slip out a few crisp yen bills and place them on the bar counter. A little bit later a fresh, hot bowl of ramen noodles is my reward. I grab a pair of chopsticks and step out back into the open, slurping up a few noodles as I look around again.
Hmmm that was odd, thought I... Wait right about... There. As a small group of people dispersed I could easily see what had caught my attention - a young girl wearing unusual red and white clothing. From a distance if it wasn't for the clothing she probably wouldn't stick out at all since her hair as just a common brown but her clothing easily identified her. It was the local shrine maiden, a one Reimu Hakurei. I had never actually really seen her in person until now but I had recalled Aya mention her a bit, not to mention she showed up in the Bunbunmuru quite often. She was really something of a legend, not only for her exploits but well, for her... Well her clothing for one. And her laziness. I think I heard she really only was ever around for festivals or to get food, it was rather rare to see her in the village.
Holding the bowl in one hand, eating as I go, I sneak my way closer in her direction to see what she was doing in the area. I watch her approach a small group of people and she says something but I can't really hear, but from what I can guess it didn't go her way. The small group shrugs their shoulders, shake their heads, and casually walk away. The miko slumps her shoulders in defeat and I see a hand reach down to her stomach to rub at it. If I didn't know better I'd think she was begging for a meal! I slurp up some noodles as I ever so casually make my way in her direction.
"Err... Excuse me are you uh, lookin' for something da ze?"
"Ugh, don't you go making fun of me now Mari-" starts Reimu as she starts to speak then turns around to face me, when she does she halts mid-sentence, "... You're not Marisa."
"Ah, no I'm not. Though that isn't the first time someone has called me that..."
I had quickly learned that my own speech closely resembled a Marisa Kirisame who was also quite famous. She was very rarely in the village but her family owned a secondhand store down the main street. I had never met this Marisa but I also had been told I was a bit similar to her in appearance as well - well, just the hair mainly. I was told I was a bit taller and my eyes were definitely not the unique golden eyes the girl had. Plus she always dressed in distinct black and white clothing.
"Didn't think anyone else spoke like that... But well, what do you want anyway?"
"Well I just couldn't help but notice you wandering about asking people for... Something. And you have a hand on your stomach still. Plus I think you're drooling a little bit as you eye this bowl of ramen in my hand ze."
Reimu glances sideways and dabs at her mouth with her sleeve, then looks back at me, "W-well... If you have to know I was just looking to get a meal around here. I... Forgot... My money back at the shrine and I didn't really feel like going back for it. You know..." the miko pauses to take a breath; I could feel the oncoming rant, "With all the stuff I do around here the least I should be able to get is a free meal! Instead they just all make up excuses and go about their lives, it's a bit depressing really."
"Ah, I see well uhm..." I point over my shoulder to a restaurant, "Want to go eat? I'll pa-" I don't even get to finish speaking before I find myself being almost dragged away by the miko towards the restaurant. ---
"Someone actually reads that crow's newspaper that much? I thought people just used the things for kindling or something." "Ahahah, yeah... They do use her papers for that quite a lot I think. I did help her for a little bit but, er well..." I shrug and pick up a piece of sushi and eat it, "I've read her paper daily for quite a while. I always thought it was kind of interesting ze." "Uh huh. If I didn't already know I could tell you weren't Marisa now, she wouldn't read that tengu's paper." muttered Reimu as she downed another bowl of noodles and added it to a stack of bowls, before she reached over to get a plate of sushi, "I still remember all those interviews she gave me. Even getting me drunk during one and still publishing it! Maybe I can blame her for no one wanting to donate to the shrine..." Over our little meal I had learned a few things about Reimu. And one she never seemed to hesitate to bring up was the fact the Hakurei Shrine was rarely visited at all, and as a result, had very few donations. Which ended up explaining why she was probably eating so much right now, she never had a lot of money to go around buying food. Really it was pretty sad, from the growing pile of dishes on the table the miko must've been starving.
"W-well the Hakurei Shrine is kind of far away... Though I guess it still isn't that good we never really go up there much anymore ze... I've kind of thought of it sometimes but, er, never really went through with ahahaha..." I chuckle weakly and snatch up another piece of sushi
"Not afraid of youkai or something are you?" asked Reimu looking at me
"... Is it that obvious?"
"The few people I've talked to here usually use that same reason for not wanting to come." the red-white miko shrugged helplessly and placed the empty plate on a stack, she started looking for something else to eat as she looked up at me again, "It's not really that dangerous as everyone thinks, as long as you stay off the animal trails and stick to the main road I could probably see you coming up to the shrine, so if any really stupid youkai decided to try and gobble you up I'd just go down and kill it for you. I wouldn't even charge you for it." she spoke the last bit with a smirk on her face
"Well I see... That's useful to know. Maybe I'll actually go up there sometime, see what it's like. I hear the view is supposed to be great up there, and I have always wanted to see the cherry blossoms when they blossom up there..."
"Well there you go. Come up the shrine and you can go enjoy all that. Just remember to bring some donations or something." the miko placed down another empty dish and sighed contently, "Aaahhh! Stuffed. That feels great. Thanks a lot for the meal er...... What is your name anyway?"
"Oh er, I never introduced myself ze? M-my mistake I'm Lanissa. Nice to meet you."
"Lanissa? Unusual name, well whatever. Again thanks for the meal, I should be going now though, I've got some things I need to get done up at the shrine so..."
"Wait! Before you go well, how about I give you an informal donation right here? I mean, I figure you might need to go buy some supplies or something da ze..."
The look Reimu gives me is one of a very, very happy girl as I place some bills of yen into her hand and she happily slips off without even another 'thank you'. Oh well, it felt nice to help her out, now let's take a look at this bill... I choke on the air itself as I look at the numbers written on the bottom and just by seeing the amount of food the miko had ordered. Well that's what I get for being the nice girl.
Although my little lunch with the Hakurei maiden had eaten a dent into my paycheck it wasn't too bad and it sure felt nice to help someone in need. I look up at the sky to see the clouds beginning to change colors as dusk draws closer, I guess I had been eating with Reimu a lot longer then I thought. Still a lot of time left until I had to worry about sleeping and I certainly didn't need to get any dinner anytime soon.
[ ] Maybe the Eientei shop is still open, go take a look [ ] Go visit the Hakurei Shrine [ ] Inquire about the silver-haired girl from earlier with all the food
A while ago, Tsurupettan from the IRC channel (Tokikofag who wrote in /forest/) said that he told a freind of his who writes touhou fanfiction to post something they wrote on /th/. I'm suspicious that he or that Tabibito faggot is to blame for this godawful thing I see before my eyes being here.
[X] Maybe the Eientei shop is still open, go take a look
Personally, I'm not a fan of adding "ze" to English dialogue considering the English language has no place for such tics, but since it's rare I can tolerate it.
Don't see what's with everyone else freaking out, though. It's not like 'ze' is Marisa-exclusive (look it up in Jim Breen's dictionary) and the name, though strange, isn't exactly the definitive mark of a Mary sue. Yeah, sure, she's helpful to Reimu, but so what? The story barely started.
>>89241 >The story barely started. Signs of things to come. Although it's not like most stories don't end up with a Mary Sue-ish PC, just by the nature of CYOA and Anon's craving for heroism and romance.
[X] Maybe the Eientei shop is still open, go take a look
It seems like people here are extremely excitable. I loathe this shit as much as the next anon, but hell it's only the second fucking post. Let's give the OP a chance to clean up. If this faggotry continues we'll sage this shit into oblivion.
>>89247 Except gaia, I know there that are a number of writers here from unpopular websites. Several from Pooshlmer, of course. At least one writer, one who is typically considered good, mind you, seems to have come from Shrinemaiden. Seriously, you should be judging this solely by the quality and not where the writer hails from.
Pooshlmer is nowhere near as bad as gaia, ff.net or devart. It just has a few touchy members whereas those three sites are almost completely made up of 13 year olds that haven't got a clue about ANYTHING. They're the definition of children that think they know better than the rest of the world.
>>89249 How's shrinemaiden compare to gaia? Shrinemaiden I've checked out for some of the english patches, but my only exposure to gaia is rage screencaps from pre-split /a/. I've always heard people comparing sm to gaia, and it truly is a shithole, but it seemed more like /b/ than gaia (not that I know much about /b/ either, just spillover into /jp/)
>completely made up of 13 year olds that haven't got a clue about ANYTHING. According to her profile she's 18, I assume that doesn't count for anything?
Shrinemaiden and Poosh hate is a old ass /jp/ relic. The 50 years and other minor memes did come from there. Not to mention most/some of the doujins get translated from those sites and their related brethren.
They combined do not make any comparison to the faggotry of DA,Gaia, or FF.Net.
She could be 40 and still be writing about Mary-Sues and posting on gaia for all age is worth. ALMOST completely made up of 13 year olds. Some never grow out of it.
Shrinemaiden has a large share of these. I can't be the only one that remembers that faggot from shrinemaiden that posted on poosh for a long time while roleplaying with his three or four OCs in each of his post.
Do you seriously want that sort of person writing and voting here?
People, seriously, enough. Just because a site is apparently 'known' for having a less than stellar community doesn't mean you should immediately pounce upon anyone from that community. Heck, this site had roots in 4chan of all places. Seriously, you're not in a position to complain - much like how not all 4channers are shit, not all people who post on fanfiction.net, Deviant Art, or Gaia are shit.
In the end you're just making the site seem like it's full of nothing but assholes.
Now, if you have legitimate complaints, make them known. You know, like the use of "ze", or the structural similarity of the main character's name to someone from Touhou's canon, or the less than stellar grammar. If you think the character's a Mary Sue, then explain why and suggest how the character can be made to not seem like one.
Anything less would be a disservice to this site and its community.
>>89261 >doesn't mean you should immediately pounce upon anyone from that community >>89221 here I googled her name shortly after I saw this posted. Just on a whim. Gaia and AnimeSuki stuck out like a sore thumb, but I made no immediate mention. I did not immediately attack her. Actually, I attacked Serial ATA in >>89163, accusing him of giving support to a friend.
Now, please pay attention to >>89218,>>89219,>>89220. Please note that they insulted the story before I showed everyone the results of my google search. I do not know if the character is a mary sue because I know fuckall about mary sues. However the writing is certainly bad; even an uncultured fuck like myself can tell that. Even if I hadn't pointed out the author's connection to certain undesirable websites and no one else had taken the bother to google her name, this story would still get attacked, but solely on the basis that it blows.
You know, it's one thing to have roots in DeviantArt. It's another to have roots in Fanfiction.net. It's yet another to be rooted in Gaia.
But, to be deeply rooted in all three of these places? It's a combination that the gods dare not gaze too long upon. There's a difference between being a member of any one of those sites and being a member of all three.
Putting aside the OP's shady past, I'd like to propose a new CYOA. It's called GNW: Grooming New Writefags. Where the goal is to tell the author what is wrong with their story, in addition to the fact that it's shit (which it is so far), in hopes that it is salvageable shit. Bad End is the newfag cracks under criticism and disappears. True End get, and the story gradually improves. Good End? They continue to improve and we get ourselves another staple author around here. Are you a bad enough Anon to save the CYOAs?
Yes, so far this does seem like it will be a generic "Mary Sue saves the world" crap, but it hasn't gotten there yet. Consider this: Maybe the title is strictly about the PC's furniture restoration job.
Just think about it. As we build up a reputation we take on progressively stranger and more difficult jobs: Coffee table for the scarlets, new shrine for Suwako, a fire-proof living room set for Mokou, indestructible gurney for Eientei, lead-insulated bed for Utsuho. With each order we have to hunt down the parts, conceive new youkai-proof designs, research the necessary technologies and magics, and probably wind up calling in plenty of favors and building up several debts along the way. Then the climax could have us bribing Suwako to help us steal one of Kanako's Faith Pillars. Which we need to finish building a media center made from sacred wood. An order originally submitted by Kaguya, as repayment for keeping quiet about her help in making that eternal gurney, because she believes the added faith will improve the sound quality of her home theater set.
Is that the author's current plan? I'd be seriously fucking surprised if it is, but what I'm saying is that there's potential here, and with proper feedback this could pan out. After all, I found the second part to be a significant improvement over the first, which was borderline unreadable. So I'm hopeful that this could reach a respectable standard with enough feedback. So on that note, I'll get the ball rolling: 1) Proof checking. Don't just do it, put time into it. Be ready to spend as much or more time checking what you wrote as you did writing it, because right now, you really need it. 2) Start reading some of the other stories here. Exposing yourself to other styles can only help your own. 3) As I said above, if you really do plan on having Lanissa save Gensokyo as your title so blatantly projects, scrap it and start planning something that isn't the goddamn cliche of horrible fan fiction. She builds/repairs furniture in a land full of super-powered maniacs, that's as perfect a setup for a slice-of-life series as I ever saw. 4) If you're serious about continuing this story, buckle down and prepare to get flamed even more until you take 1-3 seriously. If they're pissing you off, it's because you know there's some truth to it. 5) Get a tripcode. FAQ on the front page explains how. Be prepared to get flamed harder for doing so until you earn Anon's respect.
Really, I'm inclined to think that I'm just being naive and wasting my words on this, but I'm hoping to be proven wrong. Heck, maybe even if we do "bad end" this and wind up flaming krisslanza off the boards, or this turns out to be an elaborate troll, someone else will see an idea in this mess and start a "Carpenter in Gensokyo".
tl;dr: Tough love, fellow Anons, use it. We need more writefags here, regardless of their past transgressions, and there's a solid concept here, so keep the flaming constructive.
Also, [X] Maybe the Eientei shop is still open, go take a look.
I understand your point (though unfortunately your referenced posts are gone). I'm just saying that as a whole, there are still better ways to go about responding to this story besides "shit sucks, get out", which is the impression I've been getting.
>tl;dr: Tough love, fellow Anons, use it. We need more writefags here, regardless of their past transgressions, and there's a solid concept here, so keep the flaming constructive.
Before we take in shit writers from Gaia or whatever, it would be better to have none. Better a few Quality writers than many shit writers that we let write for the sake of wanting to have more stories. In the past we always told them to get out instead of encouraging them. So why change that now? Good Writers always found the way here, i don't know how or why, but it worked. And if that stops and no one writes anymore and no new good people come here anymore, than that was just bound to happen.
>>89293 >>89288 samefag here Just to be clear I'm not asking that Anon doesn't tell such people to gtfo. In fact I encourage it for the same reasoning of "natural selection" that you mentioned. All I'm saying is that we add an explanation (or even just one line) of why we thought the work in question was sub-standard.
Most of them will still leave for not being able to handle the criticism, but this way those few who are capable of improving will have something to build on. I'm definitely not asking we show encouragement for bad work, after all sugar-coating such things doesn't help anyone. Just that there be less "gtfo", and more "fix it, or gtfo".
There are many, many things that I could say to all of you - not the least of which would be a long, LONG wall of text about how you all are being supremo-elitist bastards who make groups like the New Aryan Nation and the KKK look like Mister Rogers. I will rather, however, confine myself to making the following points.
1) What >>89288 said. All of it. Manually, and whatever other memes will drive it into your heads.
2) It takes a TREMENDOUS amount of courage to take something that you write, and put it into the public forum, because when you write, you invest a part of yourself into that writing, and for people to automatically say "It's not [X], therefore, it sucks and GTFO, you faggot" hurts. And that's just in general, that's not even counting the fact that posting here certainly invites criticism - without any doubts nowadays.
3) It's easy for all you Anons to say to writefags "you suck and stay away from our site you Mary Sue-writing faggot" when you don't have a part of yourself on the line. When I write, I get criticism from all kinds of people, but you know what? I only consider criticisms from other people who've actually had the courage to FUCKING WRITE, because it's easy for all you haters to hide out there behind your Anonymous tags and say everything sucks when you've got nothing to lose.
4) In line with >>89288, if you don't like it, THEN HELP MAKE IT BETTER. That, or stop reading it and spreading your hate. So, allow me to make this simple monosyllabic suggestion: if you DON'T have good, helpful things to say, STFU.
5) I came to this site when HY's SDM and YAF's TS were still running, and I wasn't hearing problems with "faggotry" then. Especially with YAF and all his TYPE-MOON references. Hell, all your criticisms have got writefags running scared - I was surprised to learn that HY was posting other stories NOT UNDER HIS OWN NAME. I mean, seriously, people! WTH is wrong that good, established writers like HY are afraid of posting under their own name?
6) People are complaining more and more these days that there seem to be so few writers, and that their updates are few and far between - enough that the future of TP.org may be in trouble. Have ANY of you thought, for ONE second, that YOU might be a part of the freaking PROBLEM?! That writers don't come here and stay should be a sign to ALL of us.
In closing, I'll say this to the writefags: if you come here, and want to finish a CYOA, don't be writing for the acclaim and whatnot, be writing because you have an idea, and you want to see that idea presented to the world. Don't do it for others, do it for yourself. Hell, people around here don't like me, but I keep writing because I have ideas in my head, and I want to let them out.
PS: Oh, BTW to all you haters - the guy writing New World Fool, J to the E? He's on Asuki and FF.net.
>>89314 Fuck you and your feel-good sheltered hysterical whining. Nobody who's calling her a gaiafag cares if her feelings are hurt. Nobody who says her story sucks wants writers like her to stick around. Are you missing the entire point?
>supremo-elitist bastards who make groups like the New Aryan Nation and the KKK look like Mister Rogers awesome.jpg
>Especially with YAF and all his TYPE-MOON references. Most of the references were voted in, he didn't start with them at all.
>good, established writers like HY are afraid of posting under their own name You moron, he wants a fresh start without his good reputation preceding him. He wants to see his stories judged on their merits, instead of gaining popularity on name recognition alone.
>People are complaining more and more these days that there seem to be so few writers, and that their updates are few and far between - enough that the future of TP.org may be in trouble. It's been this way since last summer. In fact, it's been worse at times. I think the rate of new stories that make it past one thread has been pretty steady overall.
>PS: Oh, BTW to all you haters - the guy writing New World Fool, J to the E? He's on Asuki and FF.net. First off, way to throw your pal under the bus there. Classy. But yeah, anyone who got the Kekkaishi references could have guessed that. His writing is also pretty shallow and shounen-esque, and that's not the only story I could say that about.
I'm sure that would go over well and would ensure a long and prosperous stay without becoming the butt of everyone's jokes.
You ever think that the criticism you get is from the way you act or present yourself? Granted I'm no expert on your behaviour, but this post alone serves to bring to mind the fact that you're painting yourself as an even bigger target now. While it's all fine and good to say that people should try to help others get better, you forget one important thing: The readers are the lifeblood of this entire genre. If people won't have it, then it won't go anywhere. As much as a writer might want to have their story become the next big thing, it won't go anywhere if no one wants to read it, no matter what their reasons for it is. Considering how this particular audience can feel over certain things as well can really quite cut down a prospective authors chances depending on how they write, and not making the grade can make or break them quickly it seems. While it's a shame it works that way, in the end, Anon is the one that makes the choices on this board. It's their gestalt that decides who lives and dies, and this one wasn't good enough for them. The additional information dug up only fed their crazy fire. Would you believe I was asked to ban OP simply for her background?
On another note, HY? I'm pretty sure one name change was to see if he could escape the stigma of being HY. The others I think are because he keeps getting ideas he wants to write, but doesn't want to have to deal with the shit he'd get for starting another story until he finishes one. I don't really know his motivations behind this though, so I might be off. It's what makes sense to me though.
Write for yourself, not for others? Then why even post it online for others to read? I mean it's not like it's for their enjoyment anyway. You know who else had that sentiment? YAF. Look how well that served him in the end. This isn't a genre you can get away with being selfish in, writing for yourself in a CYOA would just be problematic unless your goals in writing for yourself coincides with entertaining a group of readers and not only to fulfill your own undeserved ego. It's also pretty low to try to 'out' someone by connecting them to a place that has been brought up negatively as if you're hoping to gain some ground that way. It kind of works against you in two ways. It undermines your personal image and makes you look like a scumbag, and it counters your attempted point at people putting themselves on the line by bringing down more potentially negative opinions that could end up harming someone more than their writing or actions would otherwise. In that case, they put it on the line but lose out anyway because some asshole tried to ruin them.
I have to wonder, what exactly did you plan to achieve with your post?
>Fuck you and your feel-good sheltered hysterical whining.
>Are you missing the entire point?
Apparently I am. ENLIGHTEN ME.
>Most of the references were voted in, he didn't start with them at all.
Oh, so it's okay for faggotry to happen if everyone agrees on it, but it's not okay if everyone doesn't? Please.
>You moron, he wants a fresh start without his good reputation preceding him. He wants to see his stories judged on their merits, instead of gaining popularity on name recognition alone.
Tell that to all the authors on the New York Times Bestseller List.
>It's been this way since last summer. In fact, it's been worse at times. I think the rate of new stories that make it past one thread has been pretty steady overall.
Which is to say, very few? I personally can only think of five or six stories that got started in the past half year that managed to get past more than 1 thread, and there have been at least twice as many story attempts in that period of time. 50% (at the MOST) is not a good percentage here.
>First off, way to throw your pal under the bus there. Classy. But yeah, anyone who got the Kekkaishi references could have guessed that. His writing is also pretty shallow and shounen-esque, and that's not the only story I could say that about.
'kay, first off, he's not my pal, he's just someone I know. Stop assuming that everyone who's on the same websites are all part of this Illuminati-esque conspiracy ring of frienship. Second, I was throwing him out there as an a counter-example: most every Anon here automatically equates DeviantArt, FF.net, or Asuki, or similar forum with bad writing filled with cliches and Mary Sues - yet, here's an author whose story all the anons are raving about. So, either the Anon Legions are wrong about the bad writing thing, or they're a league of capricious idiots.
And there's nothing wrong with "shallow and shounen-esque" writing - if I recall correctly...oh yes, that's right! Naruto and BLEACH are "shallow and shounen-esque." And yet, somehow, the public LOVES it. How shocking!
>>89314 >who make groups like the New Aryan Nation and the KKK look like Mister Rogers ...come on. Calm down and stop posting for a while.
>I only consider criticisms from other people who've actually had the courage to FUCKING WRITE Do you think only good cooks should be allowed to give their criticism about food? Maybe only architects should be able to point out that your roof's caved in? Anonymous oftentimes gives the best advice, if somewhat acerbically, and it's foolish to ignore it.
>It takes a TREMENDOUS amount of courage to take something that you write, and put it into the public forum It really doesn't. If you have confidence in your own ability, you'll see through the poor criticism and respond to the good stuff. If you don't have confidence in your own ability, you shouldn't be writing for an audience that isn't afraid to call it like they see it.
>if you don't like it, THEN HELP MAKE IT BETTER. The problem here is that it's got so far to go before it even reaches 'decent'. OP is welcome to come back once she's improved (or, hell, give it another shot now with a different name, if she really thinks anti-Gaia bias is why she's unpopular), but we'd rather not suffer through the learning process.
I'll second >>89301 here: "fix this or GTFO" is all the tolerance I feel is necessary to display.
>>1) Proof checking. Don't just do it, put time into it. Be ready to spend as much or more time checking what you wrote as you did writing it, because right now, you really need it.
A very good suggestion, but to expand upon it, I would suggest taking some time to step away after you're done with the writing and do something else for a little while before coming back to check your work for errors. Mistakes can be much easier to miss when you go right from writing to error-checking because you're used to them being there. Spending some time doing something else helps to clear your mind and let you look at your work with slightly fresher eyes, which should hopefully make at least some mistakes stand out a bit more. A first-time reader is going to have a much easier time spotting mistakes, so the closer you can get to the fresh mind-set that they have, the better.
For this reason, it's also generally helpful to enlist someone else to proof-read your work for you, though that might be a tad much for what basically amounts to a "Choose Your Own Adventure" style fanfic about a bunch of girls in silly hats who sometimes shoot at each other for fun.
>>2) Start reading some of the other stories here. Exposing yourself to other styles can only help your own.
This suggestion, on the other hand, I think can be something of a double-edged sword. On one hand, seeing what others have already done can be helpful in various ways, be it to inspire your own ideas or to make you aware of what ideas have already been done to death. It also lets you get an idea of what sorts of things work, what does not, and so own. However, for some people it can have something of an opposite effect, and instead of helping expand their own ideas, it can limit them. They see what someone else has done, decide they like it, and then for some reason can't seem to imagine it any other way. In that case, whatever they make will typically either wind up seeming unoriginal and boring, at best, or appear to be a flat-out rip-off, at worst. Still, seeing what others have done isn't a bad idea, you just need to be wary of what you take from it.
A story should be judged only on its own merits. Whether the author is from Gaia or ff.net or wherever is irrelevant to the point. Furthermore, an author has to acknowledge the fact that nothing he writes will please everyone. I'd even go so far as to argue that most things he writes will probably not please himself for that matter. Under these circumstances growing a thick skin is necessary if one wants to improve.
In fact, if someone runs away after a few flames it's indicative that the writer in question won't have what it takes to improve their writing, and given that the stories that cause shitstorms after only a few posts tend to be poorly written in the first place perhaps this is for the best.
And I'm not gonna lie, this doesn't look promising at all. A few thoughts:
- The main character makes or breaks the story. This is a CYOA, therefore the readers must be able to identify with or at least like the protagonist. Therefore, copying the name or mannerisms of an established character is really bad because not only does it invoke accusations of Mary Sue-ism, it also implies a lack of creativity (justified or not).
-Prepare to invest some real time and effort if you wish to create a good story. Not proofreading is indicative of a sloppy attitude towards the story. If you can't bother to do at least that much, why would Anonymous bother with the effort of reading your story?
-Remember who you're writing for. This has been mentioned before, but the audience here isn't friendly.
-This was also mentioned before, but you should read some of the good CYOA:s. A good writer must first be a good reader.
>I'm sure that would go over well and would ensure a long and prosperous stay without becoming the butt of everyone's jokes.
If I wanted that, I'd not have said anything in the first place.
>While it's all fine and good to say that people should try to help others get better, you forget one important thing: The readers are the lifeblood of this entire genre.
Well, unfortunately, you know what? Apparently the readers think that since they're the ones who decide which stories die, and which ones go on, that gives them the right to play God, and be triple grade A assholes to writers. As the saying goes, power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely.
>Would you believe I was asked to ban OP simply for her background?
Considering that I don't even KNOW who is OP person you're referring to even IS, I can't say. But my answer would probably be no, and WTF would you get banned for something like a background?
>Write for yourself, not for others?
You're missing my point - my point is that in an environment like this - that is to say, hostile and harsh - you can't simply be writing solely for the approval of the readers, because apparently the only thing most of the readers are good for around here is saying how much this post sucks, or how this writers doesn't update enough, or what have you. It has to be multi-motivational: you do it for yourself, the ideas you want to present to the world, and the readers out there you actually DO appreciate your story, and take the time to construct a criticism more cerebral than "fix this or GTFO."
>I have to wonder, what exactly did you plan to achieve with your post?
I dunno, how about the promotion of a little common courtesy and a little more intellectual depth on the board? Or is that TOO HARD for most of you?
>Do you think only good cooks should be allowed to give their criticism about food? Maybe only architects should be able to point out that your roof's caved in? Anonymous oftentimes gives the best advice, if somewhat acerbically, and it's foolish to ignore it.
That's a bad analogy, and you know it. I'm not saying that people shouldn't be allowed to express their opinions simply because it's not their forte, only that it's easier for them to be negative when they're not in the same boat.
>"fix this or GTFO" is all the tolerance I feel is necessary to display.
And the saddest thing is, is this kind of mentality is the prevalent one in the world today - no wonder humanity's going all to hell.
>Tell that to all the authors on the New York Times Bestseller List. Real authors use pseudonyms too, dumbass. I'm not even going to get into all the ways publishing novels is different from publishing Touhou fanfiction on an internet image board.
>I personally can only think of five or six stories that got started in the past half year that managed to get past more than 1 thread Then you aren't paying any attention. 19 stories since 2009 started. That's less than 10 days between them on average.
>'kay, first off, he's not my pal, he's just someone I know. Oh well that makes it okay then. I'm sure he'll be cool with that.
>yet, here's an author whose story all the anons are raving about No they aren't. He has a few readers, just like every other story with enough votes to update. I haven't seen a single one of them "rave" about it. What fucking planet are you posting from?
>if I recall correctly...oh yes, that's right! Naruto and BLEACH are "shallow and shounen-esque." And yet, somehow, the public LOVES it. How shocking! Okay, seriously, get the fuck out of here. Get out. You don't belong here. You have no idea how this place works or how the people here think. HINT: They were exactly what I meant when I said "shounen-esque".
>If I wanted that, I'd not have said anything in the first place.
You have that backwards. You're doing a very poor job at changing things.
>Well, unfortunately, you know what? Apparently the readers think that since they're the ones who decide which stories die, and which ones go on, that gives them the right to play God, and be triple grade A assholes to writers. As the saying goes, power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely.
And? Anon has the right to play God. They're the audience, and the entire driving force of the entire purpose to this site. The writers can rise from anywhere and try to take a piece of the action, but in the end it's entirely up to Anon if the story is gold or if it's shit and gone. They uphold their own standards of quality through force, not by dicking around with people that could become good if coached. You either have it or you don't, and that seems to work just fine for the writers that have stuck around.
>Considering that I don't even KNOW who is OP person you're referring to even IS, I can't say. But my answer would probably be no, and WTF would you get banned for something like a background?
I'm not explaining that part to you, since your ignorance is pretty funny.
>You're missing my point - my point is that in an environment like this - that is to say, hostile and harsh - you can't simply be writing solely for the approval of the readers, because apparently the only thing most of the readers are good for around here is saying how much this post sucks, or how this writers doesn't update enough, or what have you. It has to be multi-motivational: you do it for yourself, the ideas you want to present to the world, and the readers out there you actually DO appreciate your story, and take the time to construct a criticism more cerebral than "fix this or GTFO."
Anon is disapproving of shit. If your story smells like shit from the get go, you're going to have to make it not shit posthaste. Moreso, isn't this kind of strange? You claim you should write for yourself, but now you're saying that you should write for yourself and try to make the audience enjoy it? I wonder where you picked that up from.
>I dunno, how about the promotion of a little common courtesy and a little more intellectual depth on the board? Or is that TOO HARD for most of you?
You are doing a miserably poor job of advancing such a goal. Instead, you've been digging yourself a hole, and if you keep at this, there are only two outcomes. Either you kill yourself at the lip and fall into your fresh grave, or Anon will bury you themselves. You are doing this quite the wrong way. Stimulating intellectual growth through force and insults? I don't even need to explain what's wrong with that.
>be triple grade A assholes to writers Go read the thread for the new story in /forest/. You'll notice that the author isn't as bad as this one, but still isn't that great. You'll also notice constructive criticism and a measured response from Anon. This story didn't get that because it was just too awful: it simply wasn't worth Anon's time to give advice.
>take the time to construct a criticism more cerebral than "fix this or GTFO." The post you cited as good (>>89288) was, in fact, saying "fix this or GTFO." He said it nicely, with lots of suggestions for 'this' instead of just one, but that was the message.
>Naruto and BLEACH are "shallow and shounen-esque." And yet, somehow, the public LOVES it. The public loves lots of things that are not good.
>easier for them to be negative when they're not in the same boat. Yes, it is easier to find flaws in something than it is to make something flawless. That doesn't mean that we should ignore flaws because we aren't perfect.
>>89328 >you can't simply be writing solely for the approval of the readers, because apparently the only thing most of the readers are good for around here is saying how much this post sucks, or how this writers doesn't update enough, or what have you. And if you can't deal with that, leave. Every other writer is posting on the same site with the same people. I've seen plenty of praise for writers, but either you're ignoring it out of convenience, or I guess you expect it all the time like the infinite feedback loop of mediocrity-enforcing circlejerks on DeviantArt?
>I dunno, how about the promotion of a little common courtesy and a little more intellectual depth on the board? Or is that TOO HARD for most of you? People are already posting to their own standards. Nobody really gives a fuck about yours. Do you actually think you can change the entire tone of the community here by raging like this? It doesn't work that way.
>And the saddest thing is, is this kind of mentality is the prevalent one in the world today - no wonder humanity's going all to hell. Down, not across.
>>Write for yourself, not for others? Then why even post it online for others to read? I mean it's not like it's for their enjoyment anyway. You know who else had that sentiment? YAF. Look how well that served him in the end. This isn't a genre you can get away with being selfish in, writing for yourself in a CYOA would just be problematic unless your goals in writing for yourself coincides with entertaining a group of readers and not only to fulfill your own undeserved ego.
While I agree that there's no point in posting something you made if you're truly doing it only for yourself, I hardly think that writing only for the sake of others can really work all that well, either. Not in the long run, at least. Even if their readers are enjoying whatever they write, how long can they keep at it if they themselves aren't enjoying it? Do you do your best work on things you don't care about, or even hate? I somehow doubt it.
A story written selfishly with no regard for the readers won't go far here, of course, but do you think a writer can hope to fare any better running purely on altruism, caring only about what the readers want with no regard for what they want to writer, or where they want the story to go?
It seems to me that the best thing for all parties is to strike a balance between the two, to write for yourself AND for others. Focus too much on what you want, and you'll probably lose your readers' interest. But, if you focus too much on what they want and lose interest yourself, your writing will probably suffer for it.
Of course, that's just my opinion. I could be wrong.
Hey ReijiTabibito. Just so that you know, the hate that's so popular on these boards exists for a reason: to keep out cancer. To cleanse the boards of malign tumors of gaia/da type retardation and uncritical asslicking that's endemic to those places. We are not the writefag's mother, we don't have any responsibility to "foster their creativity" at the expense of giving birth to obscenely lousy stories. We have so far done pretty good work in fact, in keeping the cancer in check, while still allowing for reasonable amount of creativity, hell, I'd say the critical atmosphere here helps the writers in the end: it helps them improve. Something that is utterly impossible in the lukewarm atmosphere of bullshit that permeates those dungeon dimensions previously mentioned.
Now we're not completely evil, just like a white blood cell is not evil when it destroys bacteria. That gives a rise to a nice metaphor. If we are the white blood cells, what does that make our cute little RJ then? Junk food perhaps? After all, eating it invites cancer to the system. Just like RJ's lack of criticism invites cancer to the boards. Thus, RJ is hamburger.
I used to be one of those "shitty writer" you're trying so hard not to convince yourself this story's not. But give it a little thought. Why me, the shitty writer that got bombarded to hell and back by my stupid grammatical errors and another writing flaws, managed to get myself a sturdy fanbase?
It's by taking criticism and use it to improve yourself.
One can't write a good story if one does not take heed of the other's suggestions and criticism? I mean, You post and you think it's awesome enough. But the other disagrees. There must be something wrong with it that makes them ALL think it's bad, don't you think? If it's just a couple of person, you can brush it off as an opinions. But if all of them agrees? yeah. There must be something wrong with it. Maybe a person's mind can be clouded by ego and ignorance. I've seen the person who thinks "MY WORK IS AWESOME YOU ARE WRONG TO CRITICIZE IT" and look where he is now? Well, I think the regulars know all too well who I'm talking about. man, I used to post my updates as soon as it's finished even if it's full of flaws. But now I have to ask for a proofreaders every time to ensure quality for my readers.
I'm starting to go on a loop of ranting here, so let's sum it up. "Be open-minded. Listen. Think. And improve."
BAWWing about how the community is unjust and/or being negative to new writers is not the right mindset to approach this problem. Be open. Listen to the others. And think along with them.
Anyway, I fucking like this quote and I think I'm going to cut and paste it in my "Awesome quote book". >Anon is disapproving of shit. If your story smells like shit from the get go, you're going to have to make it not shit posthaste.
Anyways, seeing as OP hasn't posted anything for a while, I think it's somewhat safe to say you've all managed to scare OP off. That or OP is desperately waiting for more votes. As much as I am willing to give newcomers a fair chance, I'm afraid this one has too many flaws at the moment to keep it afloat. If OP wants to keep writing, I'd suggest a reboot. If not... well, have fun lurking.
>>Just so that you know, the hate that's so popular on these boards exists for a reason: to keep out cancer. To cleanse the boards of malign tumors of gaia/da type retardation and uncritical asslicking that's endemic to those places.
So, certain undesirable elements are regarded as cancer for the board, and driving them away is an attempt to prevent them from overrunning it? Purely to maintain quality, of course.
Strange, I seem to recall similar sentiments when Touhou was forced out of /a/, and when WUiG was forced out of /jp/, which is ultimately the reason why we're all HERE in the first place.
>>89479 Actually your analogy is flawed, the real reason CYOA's were forced out of /jp/ is that they distracted it too much from it's "normal operation" as far as people's perception of what that means go. It's not that it was too shitty, but that it was in the wrong place. But yes, in a way you could say that the cancer has been removed from the body, and now lives as it's own entity, and has it's own cancer.
Well, then again, you could say that this is more like a stealthy (or not so much, depending on your view) invasion by an external, hostile entity.
Well, all that bullshit even though I could have said just one line: We may be nerds who like fanfiction, but at least we have standards!
>>89479 It's similar in that it involves purging something from a community, but in those cases it was forced by the Mods and Admins, and the resistance to those decisions showed that it wasn't an entirely popular idea. This is more a case of users enforcing a standard on themselves, which inherently requires popular support to be effective, as it has been for the most part.
>Strange, I seem to recall similar sentiments when Touhou was forced out of /a/ Really? I remember TEAR DOWN THIS WALL crap, but for the most part newborn /jp/ seemed quite happy to have it's own board to endlessly post touhou, VNs, figs, Mahjong, etc in. I don't think too many people here mind getting kicked out of /jp/. Most of the stuff on this site would not have been writen if not for the exile. And I doubt WUiG would have been updated more often if it remained on /jp/.
>>89480 >the real reason CYOA's were forced out of /jp/ is that they distracted it too much from it's "normal operation" lol no
The only reason CYOAs were banned from /jp/ is that because there's this one guy named godsh0t who is a whiny faggot bitched at some mod constantly until said mod just did something to make him shut the fuck up.
>>Well, then again, you could say that this is more like a stealthy (or not so much, depending on your view) invasion by an external, hostile entity.
>>This is more a case of users enforcing a standard on themselves, which inherently requires popular support to be effective, as it has been for the most part.
To me, this all seems more like a social clique that excludes and shuns others who don't dress as nicely as they do, or associate with people in a far lower tax bracket than what they're in.
If these "standards" people are expected to adhere to were purely about things like spelling, grammar, and the like, that would be one thing, like expecting someone to use a knife and fork in a restaurant rather than shoving food into their face with only their bare hands. But that's NOT what this is all about, clearly. Not when you have people actually asking for someone to be banned purely because of other places they're associated with. This isn't like asking someone to leave a restaurant because they're smearing food all over the place, this is like trying to kick someone out of a country club because you just found out they hang out with minorities, or shunning them from a group in school because they don't wear expensive designer-brand clothes and they smell like old milk.
But of course, "fighting off a cancer that's invading the body" sounds far more pleasant and noble than "forcing out the fat kid whose parents can only afford clothes from Wal-Mart".
Don't get me wrong, we should have standards here, but for the quality of the posts and stories more than for the people making them. As has been said, we're a bunch of nerds who like fanfiction. More than that, we're nerds who like fanfiction that sometimes has porn in it. Hell, there are people who have argued over whether or not there should be any porn, and if so, then how MUCH. I mean, I love it as much as the next guy, but in the grand scheme of things we really don't have much reason to be thinking too highly of ourselves.
>>89486 >But of course, "fighting off a cancer that's invading the body" sounds far more pleasant and noble than "forcing out the fat kid whose parents can only afford clothes from Wal-Mart".
It's more like "forcing out the fat kid that's chosen to hang out with the druggies and other detrimental groups". The "fat kid" could have avoided these bad relations, but was far too stupid to do so.
If you're with a group of people that are on the same level of social acceptance as you, and you see a stranger who's trying to get in your group while having druggies on their back, and furthermore, not wanting to get rid of them, then would you want them there? I don't think so.
>>89486 Please do note, that not all us judge the OP based on his (her?) connections, in fact I'm pretty certain it's not far-less-than-stellar examples of writing that's the problem here for most people. Hell, some of the problems have been stated a couple of times already in this thread.
>>89486 >This isn't like asking someone to leave a restaurant because they're smearing food all over the place, this is like trying to kick someone out of a country club because you just found out they hang out with minorities, or shunning them from a group in school because they don't wear expensive designer-brand clothes and they smell like old milk.
It's more like a black guy walking into a KKK meeting.
>>89487 Except it's not like that at all. You're not rejecting them for associating with druggies directly, you're rejecting them for being from a place that's known for having druggies, regardless of whether or not they or the people they personally had connections with actually were or were not druggies themselves. You're dismissing them for being from the "bad part of town" even though, for all you know, there are just as many good, decent people living there as there are people who gave the place the bad reputation it has. It should be no more impossible for someone from a site like fanfiction.net, Gaia, or Deviant Art (or even all three) to bring something of value to this board any more than it is for someone from the worst neighborhood in whatever city is the current "Murder Capital of the World" to be an honest, hard-working, productive member of society.
>>Please do note, that not all us judge the OP based on his (her?) connections, in fact I'm pretty certain it's not far-less-than-stellar examples of writing that's the problem here for most people. Hell, some of the problems have been stated a couple of times already in this thread.
Oh, I know, but you cannot deny that there are people who are doing just that, and judging the OP more by where they've been than by what they've done. It's not that I think the reputation those places have isn't somewhat deserved, but I can't help but worry that the whole "we're better than them/they're not good enough for us" mindset puts us dangerously close to the sort of shit that made Pooshlmer such a wonderful place to be a while ago.
Just as we can do without "Sephiroth Wakes Up in Gensokyo" I think we can also do without nonsense like people "spoiling the purity of the spirit of Touhou because they're not TRUE FANS, we're TRUE FANS, and they don't get it like we do" and so on.
...of course, I don't think we have to quite worry about that so long as we still have stories featuring touhous covered in whipped cream giving each other a tongue bath while a spider and a giant eyeball knock back a few cold ones while playing chess on the ceiling.
...Look, the point is that the writing is awful, which earns this person negative points. Their place(s) of origin don't make them look any better, and only further ruin their already bad image. Regardless of origins, the writing is bad. Regardless of writing, the origins are bad. There's nothing good that has come from this person, there is nothing good that can be forseen with this person, there is nothing good in the past of this person. Everything that has to do with the OP is bad, and I don't like to have anything bad here.
To finish, their place(s) of origin would have nothing to do with how I see them if they were actually good. However, OP's other sites they visit serve to reinforce the bad air created by both her(?) writing and by her(?) manner of speech.
The writing is bad, this is true. The other sites are bad, this is true. Each site is bad, and yet this person is from all three. This person has provided nothing useful. They also haven't made an attempt to defend themselves or even ask for another chance.
So, why even bother? This is dead, the writing is bad, the connections are bad, the attitude is bad, alltogether this whole thread is bad, from start to finish.
Also, as I said, I'd have no problem with them writing here if their writing was excellent, even if they are a member of DA, Gaia, and FF.net. However, the writing is bad, and coupled with those three places, there's nothing good to come of this person.
>>89491 >You're dismissing them for being from the "bad part of town" even though, for all you know, there are just as many good, decent people living there as there are people who gave the place the bad reputation it has. It wouldn't have a bad reputation unless there were enough people there to give it a bad reputation. Furthermore, the kind of people that give a website or a neighborhood a bad reputation tend to drive out the "good" people. Ceasing to visit a website is also a lot easier than moving out of a bad neighborhood.
And again, people WERE criticising this solely on the basis of it's quality (or lack thereof). It was not until I pointed out the results of the google search that it really turned into a shitstorm, However people were criticizing this story before than, and would have continued to do so. Your analogy of coming from a bad part of town fails because the writer was already getting flak before her origins were revealed.
>>89492 If where they're from doesn't matter as long as their writing is good, then why should where they're from suddenly matter just because their writing is bad? People can improve themselves, and if it's possible for someone to write something good here despite being from the Unholy Trinity of Shit, then it should also be possible for someone to improve despite being from those places.
Some people in this thread have given some genuinely good, constructive criticism, and if the OP takes it to heart and works at it, I would like to think they could improve, but of course that depends entirely upon them. They may not have attempted to defends themselves, but neither have they tried to make excuses, or even flat-out reject what good advice has been given. If they've run off, never to return, then I suppose that's too bad. If they come back but are unwilling to improve, then there's probably no hope for them, anyway. But, if they do come back, and they are willing to work to make them and their writing better, why should they not have a place here?
Just because an attempt at something fails does not mean it is without some value. People can use it as an example of what not to do, so that they can avoid making the same mistakes. People can find inspiration in good ideas that were poorly-executed, and improve upon them or try a different spin on them and make something that actually is good.
Plus, as those reels of failed attempts at flying machines have shown, sometimes failures are just fun to watch.
>>89486 >To me, this all seems more like a social clique that excludes and shuns others who don't dress as nicely as they do, or associate with people in a far lower tax bracket than what they're in. Every community does this. There are always unspoken but generally agreed-upon lines of unacceptable behavior or character. They are naturally adjusted as the composition of the group and its opinions change. It's a universal phenomenon in human interaction.
And that's why we want to make it clear that the gaia community isn't welcome to come here and mix with ours. That's why a couple of especially paranoid readers were asking for her to be banned. You may feel that we're stereotyping her based on the other communities she has chosen to be a part of (this is important), but as far as I've seen, the shoe fits.
>>However people were criticizing this story before than, and would have continued to do so.
Yes, if the matter of what websites the OP was also a member was never brought up, people would continue to focus on criticizing the bad writing. My point is, that's how it should have been from the beginning. At no point should wherever the hell else the OP has been should have ever come up. The writing isn't bad because the person who wrote it is from Gaia of Deviantart or whatever. It's bad because it's BAD. Say it sucks, demand that the writer stop and never post again because of it, that's fine. But people weren't asking for them to be banned for bad writing, they were asking for them to be banned because of what someone dug up about them on Google.
Perhaps I'm in the minority here, but I think that's just wrong, especially since I've always thought the board as it is now would not even exist were it not for a certain sense of acceptance on the part of the people who were already here.
We came to this board from one that did not want us, basically hijacked it for the sake of one silly little story about lakes and eggs, and have since pretty much taken over the whole damn place. Hell, some of the sections we have now were added at our request. Considering 4chan doesn't exactly have much of a positive image attached to, either, I'd say that was pretty damn gracious of them, wouldn't you?
While I certainly don't want this place to be some happy-happy circle-jerk where you can shit in a bowl, call it ice cream, and everyone will ask for seconds, is it so wrong to think we should extend to others the same graciousness and courtesy that we ourselves received in even being allowed to be here?
No actually I'm right over here. I just said I wouldn't be able to update as much during the week because technical training is a loooot more important then CYOA.
I also choose not to defend myself. I for one am a horrible, horrible arguer and I'm not very good at defending myself. Mostly because I'm as stubborn as a rock sometimes over little nitpicky things or over criticism I view as very nitpicky and unimportant.
So I merely choose to not post anything, sit back, and read. It felt safer. I also got to read a looooot of things. A lot. Anyway lemme just give a run down...
Due to well, uh, shitstorm I'm just going to scrap the CYOA as is. While I, personally, don't see the issues in things I view as minor cosmetic similarities to a canon character (hair, accent mainly) I'll just go ahead and drop the entire character concept to save myself the grief. So I was just designing a new character today but it'll probably be a bit before I even finish it, and a bit more before I think of writing up something. Maybe a day or two. We're on lockdown so there's a lot of freetime this 4th of July weekend.
Yes CYOA was meant as a 'slice of life' kind of idea. The title was indeed a reference to her job and not to some (likely very poor and cliche'd) plot to save all of Gensokyo from some kind of evil force. Unless that evil force was bad furniture or something.
I'll take your various criticisms to heart. Maybe I'll be able to type up something good enough that won't get gobbled up in a second.
>>89497 >certain sense of acceptance on the part of the people who were already here. I was under the impression that we simply outnumbered the userbase, with ~50-70 people coming in all at once and maybe 5 people here that occasionally posted. Then Holy decided that since this was going to be the only way the imageboard would get any use, and welcomed his new overlords.
>>89499 >>I'll take your various criticisms to heart. Maybe I'll be able to type up something good enough that won't get gobbled up in a second.
I strongly suggest that if you do, you do so incognito. Use a different name, preferably one with no chance of bringing up something people might RAGE and shitstorm over should they decide to Google it, and basically disavow any and all knowledge and involvement with anything brought up in this thread. Don't mention it, don't allude to it, don't give any indication that you're, well, you.
>>89499 Good for you. You have a bright future ahead of you if you can withstand shitstorms of this intensity unscathed. My suggestions to you:
Follow >>89288's advice, especially the bit about proofreading. Grammar and spelling are the clothing for your ideas; getting them almost right is roughly akin to wandering with your fly almost zipped up. Get yourself a style manual and read the whole thing, cover to cover. It'll be boring, but it'll improve your non-fiction writing as well.
Follow >>89501's advice. For all the passionate defense of Anon's actions in this thread, I think we can all agree that he's a petty, vindictive asshole at times, and you aren't doing yourself any favors by sticking with your old identity. Of course, you can bust out the truth after a few good threads if you so choose, but I'd recommend not even doing that.
Ignore >>89505's advice. IRC has been the ruin of many a good man.
Well, for some reason, it would appear that somehow the outcome I was desiring occurred independent of anything that I had to say - so, I'm just gonna go back to my corner of the boards, and keep writing my story.
I don't know about the rest of the IRCers, but you've gained my respect for handling this so well. Besides, people are more likely to hear you out on IRC where they have names then here, where they don't.
>>89499 As the anon who posted >>89288 your response to all this has plastered a great big smile on my face. I'm especially happy to hear I was wrong in my suspicions of the story's direction (i.e. generic "save the world" fic). I really do think restoring furniture in a land where explosive magics are a form of recreation is a fun and original idea, and I'd be sad to see it scrapped.
I'll second what >>89510 said about withstanding this shitstorm. You've demonstrated the patience and maturity one needs to survive here as an author, as well as the potential for growth. That said I'll reiterate that you do have a long ways to go in improving your writing. Most of the criticisms toward your writing style (and lack of grammar) were justified. Simply put, the first post was not presentable. Regardless, I am now confident that you can and will greatly improve on this, and I for one look forward to your next attempt.
>>89499 >Yes CYOA was meant as a 'slice of life' kind of idea. The title was indeed a reference to her job and not to some (likely very poor and cliche'd) plot to save all of Gensokyo from some kind of evil force. Unless that evil force was bad furniture or something. Keep going with this idea. Just consider this whole damn thread a false start and post a new one, "Restorer in Gensokyo - Thread 1". Or maybe "Furniture Restorer in Gensokyo".
>I'll take your various criticisms to heart. Maybe I'll be able to type up something good enough that won't get gobbled up in a second.
That is the right attitude. Improve wherever you can and work on yourself and the story as much as possible to get out the best possible results. Due to the shitstorm you got the attention of the whole board, good or bad, anyway. That is a great start to get readers. Still, if the story sucks again and nothing can be done about it than that is it.
>>89497 >Hell, some of the sections we have now were added at our request.
No. All the sections here have been here since the start. On the other hand, we've lost /dr/ since we got here. We've constantly bugged Holy to add an /underground/ board which he has said every time he would do, but always came up with some excuse not to or just not done it.
>>89499 >Mostly because I'm as stubborn as a rock sometimes over little nitpicky things or over criticism I view as very nitpicky and unimportant.
If you consider any of the criticism or nitpicking in this thread to be unimportant...
>>No. All the sections here have been here since the start. On the other hand, we've lost /dr/ since we got here. We've constantly bugged Holy to add an /underground/ board which he has said every time he would do, but always came up with some excuse not to or just not done it.
You sure? I could swear that there was at least one section that wasn't here when we first arrived, and was added shortly after we did.
Maybe I'm just going senile, and confusing getting new boards with getting new page styles besides Photon or something.
In any case, the writer should dig in to http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/HomePage , it definitely won't be a waste of time from a writer's perspective. I'll help you to put stuff in context and possibly even give some nice ideas. Also it'll take days off your life if you don't set strict limits on visiting times...