- [Settings] [Home
I think Keine has the best hat. It's still darn silly though.
[Show or hide post box]

[Return] [Entire Thread] [Last 50 posts] [Bottom]
Posting mode: Reply
Subject   (Reply to 14857)
Password  (for post and file deletion)
  • First time posting? See our frontpage for site rules and FAQ
  • Further overview of board culture in this thread.
  • Supported file types are: GIF, JPG, PNG, WEBM
  • Maximum file size allowed is 4096 KB.
  • Images greater than 200x200 pixels will be thumbnailed.
  • View catalog

File 149497069519.webm - (1.38MB, firefire.webm) [iqdb]
14857 No. 14857
>>/blue/23156 brought up a pretty good idea, so let's give it a go and see how it works out.

This is the thread for all writers who want critique (despite the title, yes, real critique) hurled their way based off of their posted work. Put your name on, link your story, and wait for anon to roast. Easy peasy.

And since it'd be kind of silly to start off a thread without, y'know, contributing to its premise, I'll go ahead and offer my own work up for roasting. Sure, it's dead, but go ahead and roast away anyway: >>/youkai/28957
9posts omitted. Last 50 shown. Expand all images
>> No. 14868
Read it to critique it, ended up upset that I didn't read this before due to my general lack of attraction towards AU stories. Very enjoyable, does a lot of things right. Characters and interactions are fun to read and distinctive, moves at a good clip, prose flows nicely. Kind of reminds me of one of those Dresden Files books, and those are massive commercial successes so you know that's a good thing.

Without it being finished I can't offer many meaningful comments on the plot but it kept my interest and isn't predictable (to me, anyway) and that's all one can ask for. Really I only have one major complaint and a few nitpicks, and those are out of the realm of "this is objectively bad and you should change it" and into "I really think changing this would have improved the story, but in the end it's debatable"

It's not something that can really be 'fixed' at this point but there's one thing I think would have turned it from an enjoyable read to a real 'page turner' as you'd call it. A story where you're constantly eager to find out what happens next and f5 the thread several times a day, and it's nothing complex or crazy. It's the basic storytelling elements of a clear looming threat and clear antagonist.

First up is a real antagonist. Say, seeing the Tenma and/or some kind of tengu figurehead do clearly evil stuff to the people of the city two or three times, darth vader style, would really fuel that feeling of righteous anger in the reader. Right now they're a vague background threat that we're told are bad. Sure the main character gets attacked by one of them, once, but something a little beyond that would be good, I think. It focuses the story. I know there's Kotohime, but again she's kind of nebulous in her capabilities and threat level on top of being some kind of spirit/thought-form/whatever and we're not 100% sure what her deal is.

Same thing with a looming threat, a real stake, a ticking clock. This will probably happen harder later in the story, but until now it hasn't been there. Somewhere around the end of the first act is where this would usually surface, then the stakes would be raised again later: rather than just sleuthing at their own pace and dealing with trouble as they come to it, something happens that forces them into action at first, then into urgent action later!
Suwako realizes some kind of magical thingamabob Kanako used to bind her is slowly corroding away her power for unknown nefarious purposes, and the effect might be fatal! Boom, instantly there's tension, motivation, drama.
Oh no, the Tengu are kicking their search into overdrive for some reason, kicking doors down in the slums and spreading the word about the fugitives - with rewards attached! Suddenly they can't calmly walk the streets anymore!

Of course these are just silly examples, but you get what I mean. Unless this turns out to be a very, very long story, fantasy epic style, and we're early in it, I'd expect to be seeing some of those elements pop up by now. Instead the stakes and driving forces we had were: finding Shizuha to pay for a mild debt. Investigate a soup kitchen because it's suspicious. Help the goddesses raise faith because we like them and the way of the tengu is worse in some vague way that we don't have concrete examples of.

I'm a fan of structure in stories, because it's tried and true for a very good reason. This story is the story of a private investigator with a dark past in a scummy city. There's action, there's romance, there's adventure, there's banter. I'm approaching this critique with the mindset that your goal was this genre, a fun adventure romp in the style of the good old commercial novel. And I'd say it's successful, but lacking that final push to become a real masterpiece. The lack of those elements does result in a story feeling slightly more relaxed and opening up space for more exploration of other areas, and if that's the goal, fantastic. But reading it, I felt like it would have been truly exciting and unique for THP with the action push, more like a traditional detective-fiction-adventure thing, and it would have fit right in with all the other elements for a story worth of a real publisher, fanfiction aside.

But that's why it's just, like, my opinion, man.

Still, I'd rank this up there and I'll definitely keep reading in the future. If you got this far, thanks for reading my rant. I didn't edit it too much.
>> No. 14869
>First up is a real antagonist. Say, seeing the Tenma and/or some kind of tengu figurehead do clearly evil stuff to the people of the city two or three times, darth vader style, would really fuel that feeling of righteous anger in the reader. Right now they're a vague background threat that we're told are bad. Sure the main character gets attacked by one of them, once, but something a little beyond that would be good, I think. It focuses the story. I know there's Kotohime, but again she's kind of nebulous in her capabilities and threat level on top of being some kind of spirit/thought-form/whatever and we're not 100% sure what her deal is.

Not every story has to have a Final Ultimate Bad Guy and in my opinion, this kind of story would benefit more from not rushing along the plot like that.

>Same thing with a looming threat, a real stake, a ticking clock. This will probably happen harder later in the story, but until now it hasn't been there.

A threat of getting shot by Rinnosuke was real enough.
>> No. 14870
Lay it on me, fellas.
>> No. 14871
There's nothing to lay it on since you don't update.
>> No. 14872

Gimme a day or two to read it. Usually stay away from the once-in-a-blue-moon stories.
>> No. 14873
Your story is pretty good. I don't have any major problems with it. I do have a small nitpick about your main character's appearance though.

Near the beginning, it is revealed that your main character was born with black holes for eyeballs, thus rendering her blind. I don't have any problem with that, she is Hina's daughter so I can understand why something like this could happen, and having the story told from the perspective of a blind person could be interesting. However, after it is revealed that she was born with black holes for eyeballs, the very next sentence reveals that Hina created magical Deus ex Machina eyeballs that let the main character see just as well as anyone else.

Doing this completely defeats the point of giving your character black hole eyeballs. Its sort of like giving your character a tail, and then also giving them magic pants that makes the tail disappear so they can sit in chairs just like everyone else. If a reader wanted to, they could skip the sentence that revealed the black hole eyeballs, and it would have absolutely no impact on the plot at all.

It is mentioned that the eyes that Hina magicked up allow your character to see the essence of misfortune and make her look unsettling. This could have just as easily been an intrinsic property of the black hole eyeballs themselves. Someone with black holes for eyes would certainly be unsettling, and magic black hole eyes are enough justification for the ability to see misfortune all on their own.

But that's really just a minor nitpick and really isn't all that much of an issue.
>> No. 14874
The implication is that she was born without eyes, not with cool magical black eyes. I probably could've been clearer about that.
>> No. 14875
In that case, the problem lies in the fact that you were too poetic for your own good. Lets look at the actual quote:

>I was born blind, with nothing but great disgusting voids where my eyes were supposed to go

"Great disgusting voids" sounds really cool and poetic, but is also misleading since I interpreted this literally, as in "horrifying all consuming black holes of infinitely dark swirling nothingness instead of normal eyeballs."

Poetic descriptions can really spice up your story, but you also have to be careful not to go overboard, or you risk making it harder for your readers to know whats actually happening. Saying something like, "I was born without eyes, with nothing but two vacant holes in my skull where my eyes should have been, leaving me completely blind," would have been descriptive enough to get the point across with less risk of being misinterpreted.
>> No. 14877

I'm interested to hear what you would have to say on mine. The sharp decline in voters from my last update is making me wonder what happened.
>> No. 14878

I think you have an overactive imagination. The line you quoted gave me a perfect, graphic impression of exactly what the author intended.
>> No. 14879

Might wanna get that Chunni syndrome checked out dude. Poetic license is kinda a thing authors use when writing.
>> No. 14880

Took a few mins to read this. I can defnintivly say that this:

>“Sorry, but my past is not something I want to go too deeply into, especially not when it comes to the Mansion's residents.”

is probably what happened. That was literally what I was hanging on the edge of my seat to find out after that very sudden and unexplained fight. I can only imagine the intense dissatisfaction felt by the readers following your story from it's conception.


Excellent storytelling and pacing. However, your MC leaves much to be desired. I understand his personality, merits, and flaws are derived from the basic "Anon" type character typicaly seen in greentext stories and 4chan culture. However, that type of thing isn't really conducive with feature length stories. I felt his character development hit a glass ceiling somewhere around thread 2, which was a shame, since Momiji's character is particularly well-written. In closing, I can definitely see why this story still has a strong following even after three years, but it's just not my cup of tea.

Also, that Aya interlude in thread 3 almost made me ragequit my reading marathon. Good show sir.
>> No. 14881
I see. I guess I shoulda made it more clear that the 'thank the gods' option was the 'I'm going to distract you and not talk about it' option.

If I may, any advice on where to go from here?
>> No. 14882
I'll add to this and say that An Excuse for Temporary Word suffers greatly for being written in second person perspective. Gallagay is enough of a character on his own to warrant a narrative acknowledging his independence, and while I understand the tradition behind such-and-not-another choice of perspective, I do bemoan - bemoan! - it.
>> No. 14883
Thank you for reading and critiquing; I'm glad you enjoyed it!

I understand what you mean by the story lacking a clear antagonist or a looming threat. I think I've introduced a lot of antagonistic figures without having them actually do anything to prove them as such to the reader, and as you mentioned, that has resulted in a lack of focus when it comes to the overarching plot. However, I do still consider the story to be in its beginning stages, so I believe there's time to rectify these issues without it feeling too forced (I had already hinted at things getting worse for PI in the latest update, and they will certainly continue to do so).

I think if I had more experience or were more confident I would have started with the kind of intense, page-turner story you were talking about, but instead I settled for something a little safer. I'm not proud of that, but I don't necessarily regret it either. As you mentioned, it's more of a subjective issue and not everyone will have the same opinion (as proven by >>14869, whose input I also appreciate).

Again, thank you for taking the time to write all that. It was extremely helpful in sorting out my thoughts moving forward. I hope I'll keep you reading until the end.
>> No. 14884
I think the major problem with your story is that it appears to be a sequel. A sequel to an older story of yours that itself has not yet been completed. People generally do not like reading a sequel without first finishing the prequel. And it sounds like a lot of interesting stuff happened in the prequel, what with people talking about how Kogasa murdered a man in cold blood and Sekibanki hooked up with her because of it. Boy howdy, I bet that would have been fun to read. To bad we can't read it since it hasn't been written, and even you did write it the plot twist is totally spoiled now.

Its kind of like if someone started watching the second star wars movie, and then stopped watching it halfway through in order to start watching the third movie. When they stopped watching the second movie, everyone had just arrived in Cloud City, but then they start watching the third movie and suddenly Han Solo is frozen in carbonite and everyone is talking about how Darth Vader is Luke's father. They can't enjoy the third movie as much because they don't know how all this happened and can't understand whats going on, and they can't enjoy the second movie as much since now they know spoilers.

Its pretty much always a good idea to finish writing your stories before you consider writing a sequel for it.
>> No. 14885
> Boy howdy, I bet that would have been fun to read.

I almost feel like spoiling that entire scene just to prove how underwhelming it is.

Anyway, lesson learned. Thanks for all the feedback guys, I'll be a better writer in future because of it.
>> No. 14886
I agree with the both of you. From what I've gleamed, it's really the second person perspective that is the crux of the problem. If I knew what I was doing at the time of the story's conception, I probably would have made it third person instead. An Excuse for A-Who is too far in now, but I suppose it's something to take note for future stories.

>People generally do not like reading a sequel without first finishing the prequel.
h-haha yeah who would make a sequel for a story that isn't even finished yet right guys
>> No. 14887
File 14953815591.webm - (3.89MB, Mami vs Homu.webm) [iqdb]

I really can't think of anything. Having your MC be able to control time kinda makes him too OP for most enemies except other time manipulators and Mami Tomoe.
>> No. 14888
Ah, It seems what I was worried of is what happened. He can't 'control time' per say. More work on a 60fps while the world is running at 24fps. As shown with the Sakuya fight, He's nothing compared to an actual time controller. Had he not been speeding up to try and get away, Sakuya wouldn't have even had a fight, she woulda just curb stomped him.

Seems I need to get more into the purple prose when it comes to explaining things.
>> No. 14889

You really don't. This;

>The Yokai girl was still inching towards me, drool almost falling from her open mouth.

is pretty clear. Though I've never read a story where people with timehax weren't overpowered, I guess I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and take back what I said about him being OP.
>> No. 14890

Hm. I should take that into consideration then. I've always been of the thought that even the best works have something to improve on, and mine is no different.

As to the reason I was looking for criticism in the first place, what would you have to say on the matter of the last vote? Should I go back and explain the vote a bit more, or give a chance for anon to get the story if they want it, or should I simply continue on with 'that's how anon voted'

I admit I may care a little too much about votes, but going from 4 to 1 kinda threw me for a loop.
>> No. 14891

Unless your storyline is tied to a clearly defined timetable(e.g you can do whatever you want this month so long as you infiltrate the palace and steal the treasure before October 22nd a la Persona 5), you shouldn't have eat and sleep as options. If you're doing a good job as an author, both should fall into the natural pace of storytelling. Eating alone is also a bad vote option. I feel like you intentionally made these options undesirable because you wanted to write a Shou scene.

My advise is threefold;

1. Asking in thread why people didn't vote might lead to some people besides myself revealing why they didn't like the past updates.

2. Continue updating for a bit, and try to feel out where reader response lies.

3. If neither of the above work, you should probably stop writing the story.
>> No. 14892
Mh. Thanks for the advice anon. Imma see what anyone says, and go back to the drawing board to see what if my plans needs possible tune up. If nothing else, I guess I'll get the next part out with one vote.
>> No. 15000
File 149912902974.jpg - (65.25KB, 549x800, tei.jpg) [iqdb]
Give me the biggest roast beef in the store, friends.
>> No. 15001


1. Significantly less cliché and cringy than I expected. You've definitely gained another reader.

2. Storytelling is fluid despite conflicting and dynamic vote options. Go ahead and give yourself a pat on the back for this one.

3. Protagonist presents a welcome challenge to the form. The fact that gods in the Touhou setting have strengths, weaknesses, fears, dreams, and aspirations is something this community hasn't explored nearly enough.

4. Tolerable OC. I found his overly blasé personality kept a natural and appropriate pace with the plot. I very much expected one to completely overshadow the other and make me drop the story.


1. Let's just pretend those first few updates never happened.

2. A worryingly high number of the comedic moments, particularly ones involving situational irony, fell short. However, these instances became less and less prevalent as the story progressed.

3. The slightly nebulous "lolrandom" cloud hanging over the first thread. Take this one with a grain of salt, seeing as you eventually tied everything together stylistically without glaring continuity and pacing issues.

Your positives definitely outweigh your negatives, so keep up the good work.
>> No. 15002
Well, I started reading your story. I made it through the first few posts and then stopped reading, because in that short time I have already discovered the major problem with your story. It isn't a story. Its a random collection of shitposts that you tried to pass off as a story. There's no plot, there's no coherent cause and effect to anything that's going on, its just a bunch of lolrandom crap being flung around with no rhyme or reason.

So if you were trying to shitpost then mission accomplished. Your "story" is well and truly shit.
>> No. 15003
>he didn't keep reading
>> No. 15004
Should I have kept reading? I think most people on this website would decide whether they would like a story or not within the first 3 updates. I read the first 10 updates and they were all shitposts, and I saw no signs of that changing any time soon.

Judging by >>15001 the story apparently stops being shitpost central at some unspecified point in the future, but seeing as how I would have to wade through a lake of shitposts to get to that point I have decided that its not worth the effort. I'm willing to bet that there are plenty of other potential new readers who would feel the same way and would be turned off by it too. If the writefag wanted us to take his story seriously, maybe he should have started his story seriously. As it stands, the story starts out as a bad joke, and since first impressions are everything I'm going to treat this story as a bad joke.
>> No. 15005
>>15001 Here.

I honestly think >>15004 is a valid form of critique. His presence, opinions, and ability to influence others represents a fair and honest representation of the phenomenas occurrence, as derived from the subset of "chan" culture. Authors should definitely be mindful of this kind of thing when posting media online.
>> No. 15006
>'starting your story with a dozen posts worth of unreadable unfunny shitposting is a bad idea' might be valid criticism

Thanks for your insight, captain genius.
""chan culture"" has nothing to do with it, I just don't want to read trash. Can you link me to the post in which the story *really starts*? I'll give it a shot then.
>> No. 15007

Probably not. I seem to be having a hard time finding a common wavelength of thought from which we both can approach this, despite my status as a genius. I don't want to come off as overly presumptuous. Again.
>> No. 15008
I wrote these 2 posts.

Someone else wrote >>15006

I just feel like I should point this out.
>> No. 15009

Eh, I don't think it matters in the end. We're all Anonymous users arguing from our respective, unassailable thrones. Personally, I'd be happy to discuss a witty repartee from either side of this argument. Purely for the sake of my own petty amusement.
>> No. 15010
Eh, it matters. Talking to >>15006 would be a waste of time, whereas >>15004 is just misguided.
>> No. 15011
How about everybody stops shitting up the thread and just drops in their critique and walks away? That's probably more valuable.
>> No. 15012

Protag likes to shitpost
Main character is consistent so far and somewhat well-written


Story revolves around protagonist, don't overdo that
Updates are generally short-to-medium-length, yet updates are not frequent
Not many possible directions story can take with a main character being literally a god
No plot, central conflict, whatever - shoehorning plot/story would be worse, but it's still bad

You get six outta ten and advice to ignore people that hate funposting.
>> No. 15013
Thanks for taking the time to post some good criticism. All three of you brought up valid points and I'll keep your posts in mind. That being said.

>As it stands, the story starts out as a bad joke, and since first impressions are everything I'm going to treat this story as a bad joke.
Coming from the author, I honestly side on him with this. Of course, I didn't do it anyway because I love being a hypocrite :^) but a shitty first impression is something that no reader should ignore.

>If the writefag wanted us to take his story seriously, maybe he should have started his story seriously.
u rite

Cheers y'all and happy America Day.
>> No. 15014
File 149919904913.png - (567.26KB, 600x700, thinly veiled CP request.png) [iqdb]

Happy America Day? Without a Clownpiece one-shot? No my friend, this time, my America Day will be cold, dark, and devoid of all spirit and meaning.

As I sit here counting the seconds until the morrow and listening to fireworks in the distance, my only thoughts will be for all the lovable clown fiction that could have been.
>> No. 15015
File 149919974513.png - (203.99KB, 393x489, cp.png) [iqdb]
You do know what happens to people who post CP around here, right?
>> No. 15049
Give it to me. Raw. Don't hold back.

Might as well while we wait for the next update to come out sometime next year.
>> No. 15050


1. You respect your readers enough to announce story delays and hiatuses fairly consistently.


Your shit update schedule doesn't allow for meaningful storytelling.

2.3/10. Author harder.
>> No. 15700
>> No. 15701
Since I asked for it in the thread, why not here too.
>> No. 15711

Looks like I'm unexpectedly going to have some free time tomorrow. Expect a proper response then.
>> No. 15712

Let's start off with the romance elements. With both characters starting the story at maximum affinity for each other, where exactly do you intend to go from here? I hesitate to even call it a romance story since there's zero build-up, mystery, or chase associated with the whole affair. All-in-all, it's appropriate for a month long one-off, but leaves a lot to be desired as far as actual emotional expression and attachment goes.

As an example of what I'm referring to that you could improve on; you used "pout" and "blush" 14 and 18 times, respectively, throughout the course of a month. As things stand, youmu is more a physical manifestation of "cute" rather than a thinking, feeling character.

Moving forward, I'd recommend focusing more on expanding Youmu's intellectual side a bit. At the moment, it's kinda on the level of a several hundred year old dude dating a teenager, which is both awkward and creepy.

As far as the Slice of Life elements go, you definitely did a much better job. Always having a goal for us to pursue keep the story flowing at a good pace. The main thing here would be to better flesh out your supporting cast. Kogasa is doing pretty good, but everyone else reads like a cookie-cutter cut-out from the touhou wiki page. You're doing a good job with having them engaged in some sort of activity so they don't devolve into talking heads, but the missing piece here is motivation. I'd like to see a bit more exposition on why the characters exist in the current state we find them. Like...why was Tenshi bored enough to sit around people watching all day? Does she have a job? Friends? Some sort of purpose or goal she's pursuing? Why was Satori so busy she couldn't even offer some tea? World building is key in maintaining a good Slice of Life story.
>> No. 15713
That's about what I expected. A little surprised at:
>Always having a goal for us to pursue keep the story flowing at a good pace
>You're doing a good job with having them engaged in some sort of activity so they don't devolve into talking heads
since I didn't feel like I did enough there.

My only regret with the story is that I didn't get to go in depth with Youmu, because I was too focused on keeping things moving. Which in retrospect was counterproductive for a story focused on her.

Things to keep in mind as I move forward. I could make excuses like "I had planned for a full CYOA but cut it down for the month." and "If I had more time to write each update I could have done better." or maybe even "It was my first time writing something so far out of my comfort zone, so I was bound to make newbie mistakes." but they'd be just that, excuses.
>> No. 15720
I've always been kinda serious about trying to give anon the best stories I reasonably could, so I feel like it'd be counterproductive not to list my threads here.

>> No. 15724


An engaging read despite being based on such a cliché premise. particularly of note is how well you incorporate actions into your scenes. The way you use both idle and purposeful movements to break up the monotony between dialog is truly top tier on the site.
An example of this would be how you emphasized the fact the Byakuren was physically trapped between Miko and Kokoro during the play scene. It really helped to keep her included in the parent/child dynamic of the scene without requiring much dialog on her part.

The biggest thing I'd like to see you improve on is how overpowered Miko is in terms of dealing with other characters. In the same way a shounen character might defeat an opponent with a single punch, Miko ability allows her to immediately pick the optimal 'solution' when interacting with others. Essentially, she is handed the win without any effort on her part. There's a certain satisfaction to picking good choices in CYoA. We, as readers, get the feeling that the time we spend contemplating choices was meaningful in some way. That feeling was notably absent in some of our dealings with supporting characters. I'd much prefer if her mind reading was a little more cryptic and ineffable so as to reflect the fleeting and inexact nature of thoughts.

Another minor issue is how focused the narrative is around the two protagonist. I can't recall a single instance where a character spoke to someone not named Miko or Byakuren. Again, not a huge deal, just a bit unrealistic.
>> No. 15725

I feel like an idiot for not noticing those myself.

I'd planned some proper serious social conflict, but somehow completely forgot to worry about such things on the way there. And I don't know what happened with the character focus.

Seriously though, thanks. I doubt I'll be able to do anything about it overnight, but now I've got something specific to focus on improving. Also, it's good to know I'm doing something right with the nonverbal stuff.
[Return] [Entire Thread] [Last 50 posts] [Top]

[Delete or report post]
Delete post []
Report post

[Switch to Mobile Page]
Thread Watcher x